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Author Topic: People Who Don't Quite Get It & Ungrateful to Boot (A rant)  (Read 1253 times)

Matthew Chan

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As a forum moderator, I don't think I ask for much. Just some basic rules and common sense. You don't even have to agree with me. Although I am greatly appreciative of accolades, it is not required to get my respect and some consideration. All I ask is some mutual respect and consideration come my way.  I also have a problem with overstepping boundaries by too much. Almost everyone knows I hate cold-calls from out of the blue but it still happens.

Well, I had a guy who I helped run a mini-campaign from behind the scenes against Masterfile. I wanted to see if I could successfully beat back a Masterfile claim. Well, one "lucky" guy took me up on it.

Of course, this guy is a big talker about how is going to fight back, etc.  I don't have a problem with it because I am backing him prepared for a Masterfile response. But I know deep down this guy doesn't have much to go up against Masterfile because he isn't too keen to paying Oscar (cheap), afraid of what his wife might think (coward), and thinks he is going to out-argue Masterfile (dumb). But all that doesn't matter to me because I am trying to do a good deed. There is nothing that can be lost and everything to gain by standing up against Masterfile.

Anyhow, after a whole bunch of postings, this guy just goes dead silent which is fine.  Sometimes just laying low is simply the easiest and the right thing to do. All of a sudden out of nowhere, this guy gets self-conscious and a thin-skin and announces himself to crack on me when I only made a passing anonymous mention of his story in relatively vague terms.

I am fully aware that I could be a decent human being and let it slide.  And if I weren't heading up ELI, I would in "normal" circumstances. But I have a reputation to protect especially against lawyers and adversaries that might decide to get a bug up their rear-end to come after or accuse me of BS charges.  As most of you know, I am not against using lawyers (Oscar is my partner after all) but they are expensive to use over stupid stuff. And I believe having a brain, spine, and out of the box thinking goes a long way to getting results.

But what really upsets me is when on top of everything else, someone is going to crack on me on my own forums coming from a guy who has gone dark for months who received a ton of FREE ELI help.  He only decides to resurface long enough to crack on me, not to comment on any other thing or even Masterfile.  Ungrateful "person".

Obviously, I didn't take it well and I had a lot to say.  I warn you, this doesn't paint me as a decent human being but it does tell people to chill out where I am concerned and don't be ungrateful to the person who did a boatload on your behalf when you were too cheap to hire Oscar.

http://www.extortionletterinfo.com/forum/getty-images-letter-forum/masterfile-starts-it-round-of-2012-lawsuits/msg7576/#msg7576

Quote
Feel a little bit self-conscious do we? I didn't mention anyone by name or a specific case. You appear to want to own up to it. So what is it that I said that is incorrect? I am happy to correct it. Do you object to the "lazy, cheap, and spineless" comment? They were generic comments.

As the ELI Forums are run by me, I will talk about what I feel like on any thread I want. There were a number of people that I did go out of my way to assist and talk to for free, not just you. You were one of those guys that got way more time than I should have given. I remembered one comment made to me by someone (might or might not be you) throwing in my face how "I was the one doing the calling".  When I heard that comment, I immediately knew what that meant and I wouldn't make the mistake again.  Somehow that person thought they were doing ME a favor trying to help him. I thought to myself how ridiculous is that. I know how to handle my own situations and here this guy thinks I am doing him a favor.

I now believe giving "free" time has zero value.  So newbies get zero free time from me unless they make the minimal ELI Contribution.  They make an ELI Contribution then they get past the gate and my hospitality.  ELI Forum, self-study, stress, and work is FREE for the people who want to engage in it.  But zero free time from me and Oscar.  You got the benefit of having your correspondence against Masterfile posted for everyone to read on the ELI Documents Library which will never happen for free again. I even took the time to explain the strategy. It was my way of helping you push back against Masterfile but you seem a bit ungrateful now. I am more than happy to take your letters and your ELI Forum account down and then you can deal with Masterfile 1-on-1. Then you can explain to your wife about why Masterfile letters by Geoffrey Beal suddenly appear on your doorstep.

As far as I can tell you did not hire Oscar either which is NOT mandatory. It was way simpler than me taking the time to talk to you, getting your emails, coaching you, and posting in the ELI Documents Library. I didn't have to do any of that.

I don't have a problem with you wanting to hide out. That's fine. But don't get an attitude with me when you are the one who used ELI resources, my time, and my strategy to beat down Geoffrey Beal. I can't undo my time but I can take down the files against Geoffrey Beal and Masterfile come after you again. Give the word and all your emails will be immediately deleted. You can go back fending for yourself.

I was addressing the issue of a comment of how suddenly "my rule" of "1 image doesn't get a lawsuit" suddenly gets thrown out the window. I clarified that it was NEVER an absolute rule which is why I tell people to respond and NOT IGNORE it ... just in case. I also subscribe to fighting back when appropriate. I practice what I preach.  How do you think ELI got started to begin with?

Making some of these rash fear-based assumptions goes to a recurring pattern of those who let their fears do the talking instead of their brain. Statistically, there is still a very, very low chance of getting hit with a lawsuit even from Masterfile.

May I suggest you grow a spine and not crack on the person who went way beyond the call of duty to help your case when no one else would do it for free. As I said, I am more than happy to take down the very public letters against Geoffrey Beal if you feel that was no help to you.  I didn't call you out by name.  You called yourself out.

Regarding your comments about "appropriate time and location", I take that to mean you want to ride out the 3-year statute of limitations?

Since you are out here, why don't you give us an update?  Has Masterfile contacted you or has it been all quiet? If Masterfile has, in fact, contacted you then let me know.

I want to help and support others but I can't save the world. I especially can't help people who say they don't want to pay but to much of a coward or too cheap to do anything about it. The rest of the ELI Community can do what they want.

I am telling you and everyone, I now qualify who I help.

Regarding you, Dieselfish?  You are unbelievable after the mini-campaign I did on your behalf and you think your freaking letters and emails were such a big deal. Let's put this to a test.  I don't bluff.  I promise you I have no problems taking down all your correspondence against Geoffrey Beal and Masterfile and giving them a free pass against you.

Otherwise, just chill out. You not only don't have a spine, too cheap to hire Oscar, too dumb to fight back on your own, can't get your wife in line with what your doing, but you also have a thin skin to boot and no sense of appreciation.

I could say more but I won't.... for now.


« Last Edit: June 05, 2012, 08:58:26 PM by Matthew Chan »
http://Defiantly.net is Here! Matthew Chan Unleashed! Under the First Amendment, I have the right to share opinions using rhetorical hyperbole, colloquialisms, symbolism, snark, sarcasm, epithets, & combative language. Under Section 230 of CDA, I am only responsible for posts I write, not others.

Peeved

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Re: People Who Don't Quite Get It & Ungrateful to Boot (A rant)
« Reply #1 on: June 05, 2012, 08:59:50 PM »
I told Budd I was going to send this your way....

http://www.glitter-graphics.com/download.php?file=1845/1845636c6ij720b2v.gif&width=131&height=160

You know I love ya right?
 :-*

Matthew Chan

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Re: People Who Don't Quite Get It & Ungrateful to Boot (A rant)
« Reply #2 on: June 05, 2012, 09:02:38 PM »
LOL. Very cute graphic! Love it!  Made me smile!

I told Budd I was going to send this your way....

http://www.glitter-graphics.com/download.php?file=1845/1845636c6ij720b2v.gif&width=131&height=160

You know I love ya right?
 :-*
http://Defiantly.net is Here! Matthew Chan Unleashed! Under the First Amendment, I have the right to share opinions using rhetorical hyperbole, colloquialisms, symbolism, snark, sarcasm, epithets, & combative language. Under Section 230 of CDA, I am only responsible for posts I write, not others.

dieselfish

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Re: People Who Don't Quite Get It & Ungrateful to Boot (A rant)
« Reply #3 on: June 05, 2012, 10:26:34 PM »
Matthew - my point in the other thread (Masterfile's 2012 lawsuits) was only meant to suggest that there might be a more appropriate thread - which you have supplied here.  This way, if visitors are interested in this conversation they can read it here - if they are interested in Masterfile's 2012 lawsuits they can read the other thread without the distraction.  Clearly, this is your forum, you make the rules, and I did not mean to overstep the boundaries or overstay my welcome.

I sincerely apologize if my "going dark" or the fact that I have been fortunate enough to not need Oscar's services makes me appear ungrateful, spineless, cheap, or dumb.  Honestly, I don't want to get into a war of words with you - I don't have the time or energy (too much of both has gone into my fight with Masterfile).  I concede to you and do hope that I can convey to you that I mean no disrespect.

As for my wife's case with Masterfile, I did provide several updates to the threads that pertained to my case.  Without rehashing the entire story, I will just summarize by reminding all that I am a graphic designer and built a site for my wife's company (she provides therapy for children with Autism).  I briefly used an image for composition purposes while the site was under development.  Ultimately, I was fortunate enough to find the same image for sale by a different company.  I was able to show with EXIF data that the other company placed a copyright claiming statement and watermark on the image 2 years before Masterfile's claim against my wife's company.  I admit Masterfile could fight this, but it has been about 6 months and we haven't heard anything else from them.

So, as for "checking with my wife" - I'm sorry if that seemed cowardly.  It is her company and the claim was against her - I am just the graphic designer fighting the battle on her behalf (for my mistake).  As for not hiring Oscar - I have been fortunate enough to not need to at this point.  I'm sorry if this makes me look cheap.  I am cheap - that is why I came here to fight Masterfile rather than simply paying them. 

I may not have hired Oscar, but I have tried to help the ELI cause.  I do read the site fairly regularly and I try to comment when I can.  I opened a Pacer account and try to follow the Masterfile cases.  I admit I haven't commented as much as I did when I was in the thick of my fight - but I don't think that I'm in the minority in that regard.

I know that you deal with a lot of people who just want you and ELI to help them make their problems go away.  I can see how that would get tiresome day in and day out. But please remember that this is a very scary situation for most and most don't have your thick skin, knowledge, or courage.  I still remember the fear instilled in me as if it were yesterday.  When I comment on ELI, I try to empathize with people who are experiencing that same fear for the first time.

Please don't take this next section wrong - again, I mean no disrespect.  When you called me, and I expressed my fear and apprehension, you said something like, "you people, you are all the same - you won't stand up for yourselves...".  Honestly, I was taken aback and I did remind you that "you called me - I didn't call you".  It was the first time that I was told that my case was not unique and that I didn't matter.  It hurt because the fear was very real at the time.  And then to read your veiled summary of our interaction... I was a bit peeved.  So I apologize if what I said seemed ungrateful.  Honestly, I am grateful for all that you, Oscar, and the rest of the ELI community has done for all of us victims.

Matthew - again, please don't take this wrong - I think you might do well to remember the fear that you felt when you got your first letter when dealing with those of us who seem spineless, cowardly, cheap, or dumb.  Remember that the initial fear and confusion is very real and even debilitating for some.  I am grateful to have found ELI as the people here (you included) gave me the confidence get over my initial fear, to spend weeks researching and to fight back against Masterfile.

I do hope that we can let this thread fall deep down to where it belongs as I for one hate to show a divided front to our common enemies.  I suggest that we use our combined efforts, not in a war of words driving our community apart, but rather exposing the stock photo companies' continued use of extortion letters.

Jerry Witt (mcfilms)

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Re: People Who Don't Quite Get It & Ungrateful to Boot (A rant)
« Reply #4 on: June 05, 2012, 10:53:47 PM »
Hey dieselfish, thanks for the update. Locating that earlier image from another source was a great find on your part and something that most people wouldn't have pursued. Thanks for sharing that, it might help others. It also points to how shady some of these claims are no matter where they are coming from.
Although I may be a super-genius, I am not a lawyer. So take my scribblings for what they are worth and get a real lawyer for real legal advice. But if you want media and design advice, please visit Motion City at http://motioncity.com.

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Re: People Who Don't Quite Get It & Ungrateful to Boot (A rant)
« Reply #5 on: June 05, 2012, 11:06:24 PM »
Yes, the post was helpful.
I thought that Masterfile were a little more responsible with their claims than some.
I guess that it really pays to check all the details.

S.G.


Matthew Chan

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Re: People Who Don't Quite Get It & Ungrateful to Boot (A rant)
« Reply #6 on: June 06, 2012, 12:32:05 AM »
My comments are inline.

Matthew - my point in the other thread (Masterfile's 2012 lawsuits) was only meant to suggest that there might be a more appropriate thread - which you have supplied here.  This way, if visitors are interested in this conversation they can read it here - if they are interested in Masterfile's 2012 lawsuits they can read the other thread without the distraction.  Clearly, this is your forum, you make the rules, and I did not mean to overstep the boundaries or overstay my welcome.

Dieselfish, don't try to backpedal on your words.  I am not illiterate nor is BuddhaPi. We spoke about your comments and he told me he didn't even know what I was referring to or your subsequent remark. This comes from a guy who obsesses over monitoring the ELI Forum. And he started at the very beginning of that thread to even figure out who I was referring to because my mention was fairly devoid of details about you and your case. Online discussions are dynamic and fluid, they are not quite so linear in a thread. My thoughts come from different experiences. I relayed an experience I recalled in making a point.

Below is your quote. Clearly, you were "bothered" by my comment about you being "squirreled away". You also wanted to say I was not "insightful". I may not be insightful but I am certainly more insightful than YOU, my friend. I know passive aggressive when I see it and I am calling you on it.

You clearly wanted to steer my commentary in a different direction although it has been MONTHS since you posted anything. If you weren't bothered with my comments, you wouldn't have said anything.  That is the problem with the way you look at your situation. You think your case is so darn important to the exclusion of other cases. Just like you took my passing reference to your story that I was going to dwell on it.  It was just one passing story that you so kindly called attention to yourself.


Quote
Hmm... as the presumed subject of this rant I will "squirrel" away and reserve my comment for a more appropriate time and location.  I'll just say that Matthew's take on my case with Masterfile is interesting, if not insightful. 

I suggest that we return this thread to it's intended subject - Masterfile.  Let's save the negative comments for the truly deserved (MF, Getty, HAN, etc.) and continue to provide support those that are here searching for help. 

You of all people I did the most for in beating back Geoffrey Beal and Masterfile. I came up with the idea and painfully explained to you but your irrational self-centered fear kept blocking the logic of what I was trying to say. 

I sincerely apologize if my "going dark" or the fact that I have been fortunate enough to not need Oscar's services makes me appear ungrateful, spineless, cheap, or dumb.  Honestly, I don't want to get into a war of words with you - I don't have the time or energy (too much of both has gone into my fight with Masterfile).  I concede to you and do hope that I can convey to you that I mean no disrespect.

I don't care if you went dark. That is your choice.  But it's funny that after months of being quiet, you felt the need to "poke" me. I am fully aware this little exchange doesn't exactly paint me in a positive light but I am not trying to win a popularity contest.  People aren't coming to ELI because they are enthralled with my winning personality. ELI is about getting real, getting educated, getting empowered, and taking some meaningful action.

I stand by my statement.  You are cheap but that is your right. You are spineless because you tried to shield your wife, you tried to misrepresent yourself, and you were happy to hide behind ELI when it suited you. Even though there are many people who post anonymously here, most of them when dealing with their letters didn't try to impersonate someone as you did claiming to be some "legal representative" crap. 

You are dumb in the sense you still can't get the facts of the situation. The fact that you don't have energy over one this case is because despite whatever you wrote, it's mostly a bluff. Regarding ungrateful, I wasn't asking for any thanks but I don't recall much gratitude for the tedious amount of work I did on your behalf. Fortunately, the majority of people who are simply over their head and fearful are happy to pay Oscar. I don't get a commission for directing people to Oscar but I think for some people, like you, it is the least painful path. But again, you are too cheap and the stress you feel is self-inflicted. And now you are going to make a case you want to try to defend yourself?  If you want to see how far you can go on your own, I will be happy to take down the Geoffrey Beal email exchanges. I will further issue an email from myself to Geoffrey Beal and Masterfile that I recant my initial support of you and your position.  Let's see what happens then. I am dying to test that out to see if I am right or wrong.


As for my wife's case with Masterfile, I did provide several updates to the threads that pertained to my case.  Without rehashing the entire story, I will just summarize by reminding all that I am a graphic designer and built a site for my wife's company (she provides therapy for children with Autism).  I briefly used an image for composition purposes while the site was under development.  Ultimately, I was fortunate enough to find the same image for sale by a different company.  I was able to show with EXIF data that the other company placed a copyright claiming statement and watermark on the image 2 years before Masterfile's claim against my wife's company.  I admit Masterfile could fight this, but it has been about 6 months and we haven't heard anything else from them.

Dude, every letter recipient has a story. Cry me a river. Stand in line and take a number.

So, as for "checking with my wife" - I'm sorry if that seemed cowardly.  It is her company and the claim was against her - I am just the graphic designer fighting the battle on her behalf (for my mistake).  As for not hiring Oscar - I have been fortunate enough to not need to at this point.  I'm sorry if this makes me look cheap.  I am cheap - that is why I came here to fight Masterfile rather than simply paying them. 

You just don't get the euphemism I used. I tried to lessen the "wife" story now you force me to elaborate further.  Let's be honest here.  You made the mistake and you are trying to cover your tail with your wife. Except that you are working on a wing and a prayer barely holding it together.  So many other web developers have made mistakes and you know what they do?  They educate the client, reassure them, and then happily hire Oscar.  You don't "need" Oscar right now because basically with ELI's help, we beat Geoffrey Beal back into silence. Do you think he magically and coincidentally backed off because of your outstanding and compelling arguments?  Are you kidding me? Masterfile backed off because Geoffrey was going to be faced with some personal attacks. Masterfile and the major stock photo companies reads these forums.

I may not have hired Oscar, but I have tried to help the ELI cause.  I do read the site fairly regularly and I try to comment when I can.  I opened a Pacer account and try to follow the Masterfile cases.  I admit I haven't commented as much as I did when I was in the thick of my fight - but I don't think that I'm in the minority in that regard.

Dude, of all the people who have helped the cause, you don't rank very highly. You rode on the coat-tails of an ELI strategy that had huge ELI support. If you had just shut up both times, you probably would be better off. Now, all you have done is possibly attract Geoffrey Beal and Masterfile to your case. You are so thin-skinned you just hurt your case even more.

I know that you deal with a lot of people who just want you and ELI to help them make their problems go away.  I can see how that would get tiresome day in and day out. But please remember that this is a very scary situation for most and most don't have your thick skin, knowledge, or courage.  I still remember the fear instilled in me as if it were yesterday.  When I comment on ELI, I try to empathize with people who are experiencing that same fear for the first time.

Dude, 4 years ago, I got fearful for a short while then I got pissed. I started getting the ball rolling figuring it out as I go. How do you think ELI got going? You think Oscar came knocking my door the work with me?  I had to win him over, not the other way around. You think Oscar would have teamed up with me if I was acting like you did? Give me a break. The reality is helping people have become much more pleasant now because I learned the hard way of who to help by screening them first. No more cold calls.  I get more done in half-hour with my ELI Phone Support Calls than I could get done with you after several phone sessions. So no, I don't sympathize with spineless AND cheap. I can sympathize one or the other but not both.

Please don't take this next section wrong - again, I mean no disrespect.  When you called me, and I expressed my fear and apprehension, you said something like, "you people, you are all the same - you won't stand up for yourselves...".  Honestly, I was taken aback and I did remind you that "you called me - I didn't call you".  It was the first time that I was told that my case was not unique and that I didn't matter.  It hurt because the fear was very real at the time.  And then to read your veiled summary of our interaction... I was a bit peeved.  So I apologize if what I said seemed ungrateful.  Honestly, I am grateful for all that you, Oscar, and the rest of the ELI community has done for all of us victims.

Standing up for yourself is more than trying to bluff your way. You strike to me as a person who will bluff and I am dying to call you on it. I promise you I don't bluff easy. I still say to people "you aren't that special".  What that means is you are one of hundreds, if not thousands of letter recipients. Somehow that seems like such a hard concept for you to grasp. If your feelings are hurt by that statistically true statement, then go into a corner and cry it out.

Matthew - again, please don't take this wrong - I think you might do well to remember the fear that you felt when you got your first letter when dealing with those of us who seem spineless, cowardly, cheap, or dumb.  Remember that the initial fear and confusion is very real and even debilitating for some.  I am grateful to have found ELI as the people here (you included) gave me the confidence get over my initial fear, to spend weeks researching and to fight back against Masterfile.

Nope, I don't buy it. I didn't feel debilitated. Speak for yourself, I felt fear and it made me stop and think very hard but I was never debilitated. I was never going to sit on my hands and hope it would go away. "Hope" is not a strategy or action plan.

I do hope that we can let this thread fall deep down to where it belongs as I for one hate to show a divided front to our common enemies.  I suggest that we use our combined efforts, not in a war of words driving our community apart, but rather exposing the stock photo companies' continued use of extortion letters.

The thread was going to just die just fine until you came back again twice now.  You say you don't want a war of words? Well, you came back twice now out of hiding to confront me. Nobody freaking knows your true identity except for me, dude.  What is it that you are trying to protect here, the dieselfish name? It can't be your real name or face. Give me a break. Unlike you, I have used my real name and face since the beginning and I don't have to impersonate anyone as you did.

I promise you, the ELI community was doing just fine without you. I can promise you I don't make a habit of blasting someone on "our side" but I cannot respect your spinelessness, your passive aggressive approach, your cheapness, and how you think you are trying to help your wife when you are really trying to cover your tail.  Unlike your little beat-around-the bush, passive aggressive approach, I tell it like it is.

Quite honestly, you are the second person I've had to blast back but at least the other person had the smarts to make his comments to me through private email and no one saw or knew about it. You are about just as dumb as a rock to make your comments public.
 
http://Defiantly.net is Here! Matthew Chan Unleashed! Under the First Amendment, I have the right to share opinions using rhetorical hyperbole, colloquialisms, symbolism, snark, sarcasm, epithets, & combative language. Under Section 230 of CDA, I am only responsible for posts I write, not others.

Matthew Chan

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Re: People Who Don't Quite Get It & Ungrateful to Boot (A rant)
« Reply #7 on: June 06, 2012, 12:35:55 AM »
Steve Pigeon and Jonathon Klein are two extortion CEOs of a kind. They are only after the money. Masterfile is probably the best out of all the stock photo companies in their shakedowns. 

I thought that Masterfile were a little more responsible with their claims than some.
I guess that it really pays to check all the details.

S.G.
http://Defiantly.net is Here! Matthew Chan Unleashed! Under the First Amendment, I have the right to share opinions using rhetorical hyperbole, colloquialisms, symbolism, snark, sarcasm, epithets, & combative language. Under Section 230 of CDA, I am only responsible for posts I write, not others.

 

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