ExtortionLetterInfo Forums

ELI Forums => Getty Images Letter Forum => Topic started by: svsanchez on July 27, 2017, 05:28:01 AM

Title: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: svsanchez on July 27, 2017, 05:28:01 AM
Hello, I found this forum after I received an email from a German firm called Copytrack demanding the payment of more than 1,800 euros due to the usage of 6 images that were given to us by a travel agent for a small article on our site. The email is written in Spanish (our site is in the Spanish language and the primary public are central american visitors, although the site is hosted in the USA).

I have tried to contact the travel agent asking for the original copies but unfortunatelly I still haven't heard back from her.

My first impression was that this was a scam but I decided to research. Unfortunately Copytrack seems to be rather new so I couldn't find much info and instead I found this superb site, but there doesn't seem to be any info from Copytrack yet.

Meanwhile I have removed the 6 images that they say are theirs, and haven't contacted them.

Has anybody heard of Copytrack? Can they really sue when they are based in Germany, my site is hosted in the USA, and my company is in Central America?
Title: Re: Copytrack extorsion letter
Post by: stinger on July 27, 2017, 08:44:20 AM
I'm not a lawyer, but I think the costs of filing suit in the U.S. and trying to collect from someone in Central America would certainly discourage them from suing.  What do others here think?

I would expect that having removed the images, they will go away.
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: Matthew Chan on July 27, 2017, 07:13:59 PM
I would be interested in seeing this Copytrack demand letter. Feel free to email to matt30060 / gmail.

If someone is willing to spend the money and have the determination, almost anything is possible. But the way you explained the situation, a plaintiff (perhaps German or somewhere else, you didn't say) would have to hire a Central American lawyer to file a copyright infringement lawsuit against your company. It doesn't really matter who hosts it.  The theory is the copyright owner (Photographer or image agency) would have to spend the money to sue the infringing party, not the host.

Copytrack would not be the plaintiff but they might help provide referral or resources to the copyright owner. They are similar to other copyright collections firms. They are in it for their 30%-50% commission. See the following link.

https://www.copytrack.com/prices/

Somehow, I just don't see a lawsuit happening here based on the information you have published. Copytrack publishes their process but I am skeptical as to how frequently they will actually file a lawsuit.

https://www.copytrack.com/our-process/


Has anybody heard of Copytrack? Can they really sue when they are based in Germany, my site is hosted in the USA, and my company is in Central America?
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: svsanchez on July 27, 2017, 07:26:20 PM
Wow, what a nice forum with helpful people. Thank you Stinger and Matthew for your replies. I will send you the letter to the email you provided. It's in Spanish, do you need it translated? I'm surprised there wasn't anyone in this huge forum who received letters from Copytrack. I did find a French and a Spanish forum with some people asking about them from late 2016 to-date.
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: svsanchez on July 28, 2017, 12:05:20 AM
Hello again Mr. Chan, I just sent you the email I received (in Spanish) with the translation to English. I also signed up to the ELI Phone Support Call  :)

Hop to hear from you soon and also from others who have received this type of letters from Copytrack.
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: Matthew Chan on July 28, 2017, 12:47:08 AM
Hello Svsanchez,

We are primarily an American community but we have a fair amount of Canadian, Australian, and UK readership since all the countries are English-speaking.

We do our best to assist non-U.S. folks but the vast majority of our expertise is clearly based on U.S. practices. But there are many commonalities in the tactics and strategies used outside the U.S.

Any necessary translation I do would be done through Google Translate but that gives spotty imprecise results from my experience.

The one thing that many people notice about us vs. other websites is that we cultivate "out of the box" and unconventional thinking. We also embrace an "edgy", rebellious, -fight-back attitude.  Not sure where that attitude comes from....  ;-)

Wow, what a nice forum with helpful people. Thank you Stinger and Matthew for your replies. I will send you the letter to the email you provided. It's in Spanish, do you need it translated? I'm surprised there wasn't anyone in this huge forum who received letters from Copytrack. I did find a French and a Spanish forum with some people asking about them from late 2016 to-date.
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: Matthew Chan on July 28, 2017, 12:48:22 AM
Thank you for your submission and allowing me to view my very first Copytrack Demand Letter. I will certainly read, study, and translate it. And I will share it with our team so they are also up to speed.

I have also responded to you via email privately.

Hello again Mr. Chan, I just sent you the email I received (in Spanish) with the translation to English. I also signed up to the ELI Phone Support Call  :)

Hop to hear from you soon and also from others who have received this type of letters from Copytrack.
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: Robert Krausankas (BuddhaPi) on July 28, 2017, 12:42:39 PM
As a side note the OP stated the images in question were "given" to us by a travel agent...This is a huge problem that I see often. Couple of things here.
1. when images are "given" or supplied, there in no way to now if the "giver" owns the images or the rights to said images.
2. many times license agreements and not "transferable"...meaning  IF the "giver" did indeed purchase a license, the terms in most cases state the images can only be used by the licensee and not
'handed down to someone else.

I had a client that owned a shoe store, he was supplied images/logos from the shoe manufacturer..the manufacturer used Getty images for their imagery..My client gets letter from Getty..Shoe manufacturer had to get involved and Getty went away, but it was a pain in the ass for my client.
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: svsanchez on July 31, 2017, 09:28:23 PM
Hello, thank you for your comments. What Robert Krausankas said is very important, I had never thought of it: as a webmaster I make websites for customers with online catalogs. They usually ask permission to their providers to copy their photos, but I will have to tell them to make sure they are allowed to do this.

Matthew, I replied to your email.
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: satoshiwaves on September 05, 2017, 01:55:12 PM
Hi everyone,
found this thread by search engines. I have the same problem. Today I got the same kind of email from Copytrack and they asked for 1300 Euros for an image on a website that I forgot about, it's an image of a muffin on a muffin gallery site. I didn't steal the image but used an automated WordPress plugin to fetch the free images of muffins I thought and this was like 4 years ago, the plugin schedule and post content of a given keyword automatically. I didn't add that image by myself. I have deleted all the images on my website.
Any advice about how I should proceed this? Should I reply to their threat email? They want an answer latest 19th Septemeber they say in that email.

Thanks in advance!
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: Roxannah on September 14, 2017, 03:20:58 PM
I was contacted by Copytrack and I am in the same situation. I used a photograph of a band I found on their facebook page on an article and credited the author, both in the article and in the link of the photograph. Apparently, this wasn't not enough, and I was hit with the email to buy the photo. I contacted the photographer directly, she said she can't get involved in this issue anymore, as it is out of her hands.

I run a blog that generates no income, and it's not a legally constituted company. It isn't even registered anywhere.... it is just a digital blog. I am currently unemployed and have no assets under my name they can come after, so I have no means of paying the €400 they ask. The blog is hosted in Portugal. I replied saying I sourced the photograph, they didn't care. So I emailed back stating my current situation and I'm still waiting for a reply.

Is a lawsuit likely to happen in this scenario? How did other situations evolve?
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: Matthew Chan on September 14, 2017, 08:43:08 PM
My comments inline...

I was contacted by Copytrack and I am in the same situation. I used a photograph of a band I found on their facebook page on an article and credited the author, both in the article and in the link of the photograph. Apparently, this wasn't not enough, and I was hit with the email to buy the photo. I contacted the photographer directly, she said she can't get involved in this issue anymore, as it is out of her hands.

The photographer doesn't want to get his hands dirty. It is their case and they can handle it anyway they want to if they are inclined. However, they hired Copytrack.

I run a blog that generates no income, and it's not a legally constituted company. It isn't even registered anywhere.... it is just a digital blog. I am currently unemployed and have no assets under my name they can come after, so I have no means of paying the €400 they ask. The blog is hosted in Portugal. I replied saying I sourced the photograph, they didn't care. So I emailed back stating my current situation and I'm still waiting for a reply.

If you don't have enough money to pay a negotiated settlement, then your path is clear. Just ignore it. You can't pay money you don't have.

Is a lawsuit likely to happen in this scenario? How did other situations evolve?

Only speaking for U.S. situations, I have not heard of any Copytrack-originated lawsuits. And you just got done saying you are not able to pay, a lawsuit will not squeeze money where there is none.

Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: satoshiwaves on September 27, 2017, 05:13:00 AM
I was contacted by Copytrack and I am in the same situation. I used a photograph of a band I found on their facebook page on an article and credited the author, both in the article and in the link of the photograph. Apparently, this wasn't not enough, and I was hit with the email to buy the photo. I contacted the photographer directly, she said she can't get involved in this issue anymore, as it is out of her hands.

I run a blog that generates no income, and it's not a legally constituted company. It isn't even registered anywhere.... it is just a digital blog. I am currently unemployed and have no assets under my name they can come after, so I have no means of paying the €400 they ask. The blog is hosted in Portugal. I replied saying I sourced the photograph, they didn't care. So I emailed back stating my current situation and I'm still waiting for a reply.

Is a lawsuit likely to happen in this scenario? How did other situations evolve?

Any updates about your case?
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: junaid-pakistan on October 05, 2017, 09:52:34 AM
Hey Guy. Feel bad about you. Just so you know the purpose of giving credit is to promote some one elses work and also if its on web it gives them an extra link this its a positive thing seo wise. I have a website and i got same email frm copy track.
When you put a link back or do not change the meta of images it helps them find you easily. Thats what most good people do. Since the main source of income for copy track is to threat people and make money and share it with original photographer so they try their best to get as much from you. In my case my website is just a student project name uniquethingstodo and i had some friends working on it for learning and analytics purpose. I would say remove images if the owner is not happy. Also I have Pakistani Passport but i registered it in Canada. Whatever they dont know alot that i put some ones mobile number in canda just to get a domain in canada name because its good for seo and atil lthey are trying to threat me LOL ! They dont know but i am learning from this also because i am a student. I learnt how companies make money based on fear of others (so i invited them to peoceed because i have alot to peove like i have documents which say the images uplaoded by authors are responsible which are my friends).
Is there any body who actually moved to final step in this process ? Like called by court or website shutdown or something ?
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: an.stephen on October 13, 2017, 03:32:37 PM
Any update on this?
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: ChrisDH on November 03, 2017, 07:18:24 AM
Hi guys,
Our company as well received an email 2 weeks ago from Copytrack, and today a reminder stating we have till the 16th of November to respond...The same as the other stories above, in Spanish, we are a Spanish company but we hired a company based in India to do the SEM for us, and they have posted photos etc...
So we don't know what they post, the only thing that matters to us us the result.
So if I would tomorrow post things anywhere, and start a business let's name is copytracktoo, then i can start sending emails to all these people and demanding money from them. Is it that easy? Is this a scam? What do we do about it? They haven't said how much they want from us...
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: kingkendall on November 04, 2017, 12:40:40 AM
Put the letter in a manila folder and do nothing.  Read the forum, a lot of good info here, get educated instead of getting panicked.  That deadline will pass and go until they send you another letter with a new deadline. 
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: Matthew Chan on November 09, 2017, 02:02:08 AM
Absent some compelling information or unexpected developments, I tend to believe Copytrack is pretty harmless to most people. They might persistently and annoyingly nag people for payment but I have not yet seen them take any meaningful action against anyone in the U.S.
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: Jolafrite59 on November 13, 2017, 06:08:05 AM
Hello!

I have a website in France and have exactky the same problem! 2 pictures on my website!
I got 2 letters from copytrack in Germany.
Now a french company is trying to get the money from me. I got one letter from the french company and one phone call also. I did not answered.

Please help!!!!
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: MC2 on November 28, 2017, 06:58:23 AM
Hi.

We also received a letter from Copytrack. We run a small (non-profitable) online arts magazine that we use to attract visitors to a website for a small city in the UK. We published an article early 2013 promoting a show at a nearby venue and were supplied with a photo by the venue (or artist's/event's pr agency, we honestly can't remember which). In October 2017 we received a letter from Copytrack billing us for 1400 Euros. We removed the image and ignored the letter. In the last few days we have received another letter asking us to transfer the funds. We are ignoring that too.

The way I see it is that Copytrack need to prove we were using it illegally. And if we were then they need to chase the PR agency that supplied it to us as we used it in good faith (and good luck with that as we have no record of who it was).

Basically Copytrack can send us as many threatening letters as they like but until they gain a court judgement (legal in a post-Brexit Britain) then we're not going to respond.

Of course, it would help their case if their letter was  much more than merely an invoice. It's as if they expected us to us to know who they were and that they were a legitimate concern with a legitimate claim. As they can't even be bothered to explain that my feeling is that they are basically chancers who hope the people they threaten with these invoices cave in and send them money, but that when faced with spending money themselves they won't follow it up. We shall see.
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: MC2 on January 04, 2018, 11:34:40 AM
Today we received our fifth (or maybe sixth!) missive from Copytrack. This time it was sent on behalf of Copytrack from Credit Limits International (www.creditlimitsinternational.com) an international debt collection agency based near us in the UK. We are continuing to ignore all letters about this issue.

If they were serious about collecting the money they'd have rung us by now.
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: MC2 on January 04, 2018, 12:00:34 PM
After a little research I have discovered that Credit Limits International Ltd are not authorised to collect debts in the UK.

Here, try a search on the Financial Conduct Authority's web site:

http://fca-consumer-credit-interim.force.com/CS_RegisterSearchPageNew

So that's that then. Copytrack and their UK debt collection agency Credit Limits International Ltd are nothing by chancers. Ignore them.
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: Matthew Chan on January 09, 2018, 01:10:21 AM
These are copyright claims, not debts they are trying to collect. In any case, it is not so easy to get money from someone unwilling to pay. Hence, the reliance on people's legal ignorance and general fear-inducing strategies.

In my view Copytrack, so far, has been largely "harmless". Lots of notifications and threats but little else.
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: lostpike on January 12, 2018, 09:37:15 PM
Was doing some research on Copytrack and came across your site and figured I would share the reason I was researching them. They currently have an ICO for a cryptocoin.

https://copytrack.io/

Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: MC2 on January 13, 2018, 06:32:23 AM
Unbelievable. Not yet another dodgy company trying to raise money or boost share value by staging an ICO for a cryptocoin. There's going to be a lot of tears when all these prove worthless (and they will be).

Its Copytrack who have treated the copyright claim as a bad debt. The letter sent by the debt collecting agency they've employed makes this plain.
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: Matthew Chan on January 15, 2018, 05:46:32 PM
Well, their credibility just dropped as far as I am concerned. They want to dabble in cybercurrency along with trying to issue demand letters? None of that mixes well in my mind.


Was doing some research on Copytrack and came across your site and figured I would share the reason I was researching them. They currently have an ICO for a cryptocoin.

https://copytrack.io/
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: scaffolding on February 17, 2018, 11:01:04 PM
Hi Guys,

It's my first post here, stumbled upon a same case as I have.

I run a small business in Indonesia and we've just refresh our website with new layout and contents about 2 months ago.

Our website doesn't have much images as most images are about the products, sent by the product owners. We added some clickbait articles and get the images related to them from internet.

I got an email from Copytrack days ago, insisting me to buy a photo that used in our website for about 300 euros. It says removing the picture will not inhibit legal enforcement.

We've just removed it from our website, but I wonder how it will end? And how frequently it is happened?

The clause "Removing the picture will not inhibit the legal enforcement", is it legal? We've just posted the image less than 2 months and the page has very small amount of visitors.

300+ euros means a lot for our small business.
Any help is appreciated.
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: MC2 on February 18, 2018, 03:35:55 AM
Frankly I'm amazed they bothered to contact you with a claim for only €300. I that no experience here (and certainly my own experience) is that they'll send you a string of letters, culminating with one from a third party debt collection agency and then give up and leave you alone. This assumes that you have taken the image down and don't reply to any of their missives.

In short, they are chancers. Ignore them and eventually they'll go away.
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: scaffolding on February 18, 2018, 11:05:57 AM
MC2, I think it's 300 euros because only 1 image. If you read 1st post in this thread by svsanchez he said he was charged by Copytrack for 1800 euros for 6 images.

I've just read posts about this similar subject in some forums.
I understand that using copyrighted digital material with intention is an infringement and is subject to a lawsuit.

The thing that still came in my mind is the email is simply threatening users with clause "Removing the image will not inhibit law enforcement".
This may be relevant if the user is an established company or the user deliberately resells the digital material even though he/she knows it's a violation.

I live in a country where many families earn about USD 400 - 600 per month per family. That amount is supporting a whole family members, including school tuition for kids, foods, installments or loans. Saving may be only USD 2500 - 4000 per year per family.

Imagine that a kid on the family learns to build website or learn to use social medias, and then uses some images he/she found on internet without feeling guilty and without having sufficient copyright knowledge.
Then it comes an email from Copytrack, demanding thousands of euros for that images, and stating that removing the images is not simply inhibiting the law enforcement...
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: MC2 on February 18, 2018, 01:54:17 PM
The scammers tried to get £1400 out of us for one image. I think the charge must reflect the length of time the image was used for.

Anyway, don't fret. Put the letter in the bin and put all other letters you receive from them in the bin too. Don't worry, and don't think about Copytrack. They are snivelling cowards.

Have a nice life.
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: irabala on April 02, 2018, 07:12:42 AM
1. If you have lots of cash or jewels, will you keep it on road just like that and expect no one to take it? Is it not your responsibility to protect your assets? 
I think the same thing applies to these images. Is it not important people to protect the images from people copying it?  Is it only the responsibility of the other side?  There are so many technologies and methodologies available where the images cannot be copied or scrapped.  Even the images need not be indexed or added to the robots which prevent Google to copy?
Or at-least image should be marked with copyright and owner information?  How is it legally binding to the end user when the owner of the image does not bother to prevent some one using it when in public domain (even does  not bother to mark it with copy right information) and later crying foul?  Will owner's negligence will never be accounted for, irrespective whether the end user uses the images with full knowledge or without any knowledge?   
2.  And how review websites and travel websites works?  They also take these kinds of images and use it.  Do they take permission from all the companies across the world?   Or the third party user who does the review on the review website uploads the image , then who becomes responsible? 
3.  If the image is stored but not used and the web crawler shows that the image is in your website, does that amounts to unlawful behavior?
Title: Few Questions on Extortion Mails and Image owners
Post by: irabala on April 02, 2018, 03:25:43 PM
I have few questions:
1.  Will Storing image in wordpress media will amount to image theft?
2.  If I have costly jewels, either I will keep it my locker or keep with myself in a way that nobody can take it.  I will not keep on some public domain and then cry theft when some one knowingly or unknowingly take it.  If I keep it willingly or due to negligence, still I also hold part of responsibility for the loss.  If I think my jewel which is my asset is very important why I am going to keep on some street corner or on road?  Does that not apply images where owners need to protect it and also take responsibility?  There are so many technologies and methods where image cannot be used or google will not display it.  Is tempting or encouraging people to commit some crime is more offence than committing a crime (if this is a crime as stated by these watchdog agencies)?
3.  Please see the link:  https://abmahnung.sos-recht.de/en/copytrack/  what is your response for the same?
4.  See the links: https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/60020281 and https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/60809813  These links are just for your info.
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: UnfairlyTargeted on April 02, 2018, 04:12:21 PM
Services like Pixsy/Copytrack and photographers who use them make my blood boil.  A service for talentless hacks to extract value from otherwise worthless images circulating the sewers of the photo sharing "look at me" sites.  Half these so-called-photographers would chomp at the bit to get a few more likes for their crappy photos by paying money to promote them, but yet they somehow get pissed off when the images are actually used.  Look it up.  Do some research in the forums where they hang out.  I did!

Then name and shame them.
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: UnfairlyTargeted on April 02, 2018, 04:52:09 PM
There's one guy in that forum link above bragging about how he bought a new lens for his HOBBY.  It's a f'ing hobby to extort people?!

THIS is exactly what I was talking about.  These people would never have sold their images.  They're just cashing in on an extorted windfall.
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: Mihki on April 09, 2018, 02:37:33 PM
Hi,
been reading this topic as we also ran into Copytrack. We are a small company based in UK and they requested for 1 image from us 1000 E. We got the image in good faith from one of our partners and that image was of poor quality and used only on informational part of the website. We removed the image in question immediately from our website and offered to pay a fair market value to copytrack for the use (we did not have intention of using any image without consent).
They said they are willing to settle and we should make an offer. We offered 100E which is more than the image is worth which they declined.

They sent us a couple of letters after that requesting payment and in the last one they are threatening that they will use a debt collector agency(probably the same one MC2 mentioned).

We do not plan to pay such crazy amount for 1 image as it is plain extortion. We are now waiting for new letters from them. If they wish they can take us to court but they will not be able to collect as we are just starting and cannot pay such amounts.

We also contacted lawyers from https://abmahnung.sos-recht.de/en/copytrack/   but these guys are also very shady. They asked what was the amount requested from Copytrack and gave their quote of almost 400E + some fees. They stated that we should not pay more than 200E for 1 image. When I asked from more info like exact cost of their services, what will be the expected outcome if we hire them (what they can achieve with copytrack) they never responded. I would not be surprised if they work together with copytrack and use this company as a front to extort money from people (400 E to them + 200 E to copy track is 600E which is not bad).

MC2 any updates from your side?
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: mikib on October 13, 2018, 07:30:47 PM
I know this is an old thread, but I just wanted to chime in as a photographer, who is not making a ton of money but a lot of my photos routinely get stolen and used allover the internet with zero compensation to me. I use Copytrack to help me track those websites and go after them for payment.

So I actually think it's horrible the way you guys are talking about it because, honestly, it doesn't matter if you're a small company or a blog or not profitable or whatever, you are using someone else's work for free and trying to get away with it by providing "credit", which frankly doesn't pay my bills. Photography is not free, even if you can find it on google images with a quick search and save it on your computer, it doesn't mean you can just put it up on your website for free. Content creation costs money.

So even though Copytrack starts out by asking pretty high amounts of money (which is typically our normal rate + damages because the photographer has the right to decide what kind of website can use their work), you should at the very least try to negotiate it down to something you can afford and pay it. At the end of the day if you can't afford to pay for the images then you should be using royalty free images or not have a website at all. "I don't make enough money so I should be able to use other people's work for free because they can't stop me" is a terrible argument, sorry!

I know some of you got into this situation thinking what you were doing is ok but please educate yourself on this and pay the poor photographer!! Even if it's not the full amount they're asking, anything is better than nothing and you benefited from their work so it's the right thing to do.
Title: Re: Copytrack extortion letter
Post by: Matthew Chan on October 16, 2018, 09:09:53 PM
Thank you for your well thought out post. I respect your view as a photographer and get where you are coming from. However, the central issues of extreme contention which keeps ELI alive and well are:

1.  There is no warning letter whatsoever.  Just out of the blue, a demand letter shows up demanding thousands of dollars based on no particular rhyme, reason, or formula. And yet the major media companies actually do and practice this. It is the smaller players who engage in these ugly, distasteful practices.

2.  The amounts being demanded is almost an outrageous, outlandish amount that is not connected to the market value of an image.  It is almost an intentionally punitive amount.

3. These are not generally criminal matters, they are civil matters. But some do their best to "criminalize" the matter and use that fear to coerce excessive amounts of money for "compensation".

4. Not all infringements are "deserving" of monetary compensation.  Some infringements are of a "de minimus" nature. Yes, it is upsetting to see someone infringe your work. I have seen others directly pirate my published works over the years and I have sent unhappy emails over the years. But I made no monetary demands of them. But I did demand they take down the material.  Because you know why?  They are usually rinky-dink infringements from some poor schmuck who didn't know better and I called them out. And they COPIED the material, they didn't literally take it from me. I still have the source just like all photographers still have their original image. They are not deprived of their image.  To be clear, I am not saying that there aren't situations where monetary demands aren't sometimes appropriate but there are a lot of cases I see where it is simply a punitive and excessive profit play.

I agree with many statements you make. We do try to educate people.  And as "liberal" as I might be for the defense, some stuff I hear is just plain ridiculous.  Some people propose some outlandish reasons to justify piracy and infringements. However, many people are in the grey area where it is not so clear.

Content creation does cost time and money. This website has plenty of content.  I have written and produced many books and audio programs.  People are constantly using ELI information and reading/using what I write without compensating me. Should I start locking down everything nailing every single person who "profited" from my work and knowledge? Should I start beating everyone for money because of the benefits they derive? If I did that, then I surmise it will be celebratory day for Higbee, Getty, Masterfile, PicRights, ImageRights, and scores of photographers.

I would say many photogs have a very narrow view of how to handle their photography. They have a very narrow view how to monetize and benefit from their photography beyond plastering it on photography websites and using companies to squeeze/extort money from ignorant/unknowing infringers.

Since I am not being paid by anyone how to handle these things, I will keep my information and my advice to photogs to myself. But I will provide a hint.  Read the book "Free" by Chris Anderson.  There are clues and suggestions there.  But trying to beat and extort money out of every perceived wrong and de minimus infringement will result in a lot of bad energy and bad karma.  That is why there is such a bad reaction. People know "fair and reasonable" when they see it. "Squeeze, scare, and get as much as you can" is still the rule of the day.

Every occupation has an occupational hazard of some kind. For any content producers (photographers, authors, publishers, etc), piracy is an occupational hazard. If you are constantly worried about beating down and extorting money from every infringer you find, that is your right but you might be in the wrong business. Keep your images private and never use it publicly.  That is the only surefire way to have your images never be pirated or infringed upon.

If it costs so much to produce photos, then get out of the business!  Keep it as a hobby but make money doing something else. Being a photog could be hazardous to your financial well-being and your reputation!

I know this is an old thread, but I just wanted to chime in as a photographer, who is not making a ton of money but a lot of my photos routinely get stolen and used allover the internet with zero compensation to me. I use Copytrack to help me track those websites and go after them for payment.

So I actually think it's horrible the way you guys are talking about it because, honestly, it doesn't matter if you're a small company or a blog or not profitable or whatever, you are using someone else's work for free and trying to get away with it by providing "credit", which frankly doesn't pay my bills. Photography is not free, even if you can find it on google images with a quick search and save it on your computer, it doesn't mean you can just put it up on your website for free. Content creation costs money.

So even though Copytrack starts out by asking pretty high amounts of money (which is typically our normal rate + damages because the photographer has the right to decide what kind of website can use their work), you should at the very least try to negotiate it down to something you can afford and pay it. At the end of the day if you can't afford to pay for the images then you should be using royalty free images or not have a website at all. "I don't make enough money so I should be able to use other people's work for free because they can't stop me" is a terrible argument, sorry!

I know some of you got into this situation thinking what you were doing is ok but please educate yourself on this and pay the poor photographer!! Even if it's not the full amount they're asking, anything is better than nothing and you benefited from their work so it's the right thing to do.