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Author Topic: Extortion Letter from LCS  (Read 8349 times)

greg

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Extortion Letter from LCS
« on: December 18, 2015, 12:59:33 AM »
So not sure if anyone else has ran into this one but I got notice from LCS about having to pay for usage of an image on a site I built for a friend of mine.  Well after finding what they claimed was copied was roughly 10% of the original image, a tree got taken out of the image and used in a WordPress theme that is still published in the WordPress repository.  But authors of themes and plugins have to publish there code under GPL which im my eyes makes the author of the plugin liable for any copyright ingrigments.  As my license was GPL and used in good faith that all content was covered under that license.

Funny thing the email about the infridgement came after the site had already been down for a few months.  So not only was the image from a WordPress.org repository theme but it also was since removed from the web.

Wondering what other peoples thoughts on this are?
« Last Edit: December 18, 2015, 09:03:01 AM by greg »

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Re: Extortion Letter from ICS
« Reply #1 on: December 18, 2015, 02:01:44 AM »
ICS?  Do you mean LCS as in License Compliance Services?
I'm a non-lawyer but not legally ignorant either. Under the 1st Amendment, I have the right to post facts & opinions using rhetorical hyperbole, colloquialisms, metaphors, parody, snark, or epithets. Under Section 230 of CDA, I'm only responsible for posts I write, not what others write.

greg

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Re: Extortion Letter from LCS
« Reply #2 on: December 18, 2015, 08:36:29 AM »
Why LCS would be correct, lol. I Corrected it I believe.

License Compliance Services, Inc. on behalf of 500px Inc.
« Last Edit: December 18, 2015, 09:03:42 AM by greg »

greg

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Re: Extortion Letter from LCS
« Reply #3 on: December 18, 2015, 11:32:17 AM »
So now this LCS company is trying to quote WordPress.com's TOS which states:
 
Quote
If you operate a blog, comment on a blog, post material to WordPress.com, post links on WordPress.com, or otherwise make (or allow any third party to make) material available (any such material, “Content”), you are entirely responsible for the content of, and any harm resulting from, that Content. That is the case regardless of what form the Content takes, which includes, but is not limited to text, photo, video, audio, or code.

Resolution includes the removal of the imagery and the payment of the settlement fee for the unauthorized use. If payment is not received by the aforementioned date this case will escalate to legal. And the fee will revert to the original amount plus legal fees will be added.

Which I agree with but first off the site was not on WordPress.com, it was a self hosted blog which was using an unmodified repository theme which is required to have the following licensing pieces.

  • Be 100% GPL and/or 100% GPL-compatible licensed.
  • Declare copyright and license explicitly. Use the license and license uri header slugs to style.css.
  • Declare licenses of any resources included such as fonts or images.
  • All code and design should be your own or legally yours. Cloning of designs is not acceptable.

I also noticed they changed their address from their initial address from 605 Fifth Avenue South, Suite 400, Seattle, WA 98104 a known Getty Images address to 701 Fifth Avenue, Suite 4200, Seattle, WA 98104 as if moving would matter.
   
   
   

greg

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Re: Extortion Letter from LCS
« Reply #4 on: December 18, 2015, 12:25:29 PM »
Not that it matters but I decided to find said image on 500px website and also check out their Corporate Licensing Agreement.

Their restrictions on use policy state:
Quote
Without obtaining the prior written consent of 500px and the payment of an additional license fee,
include the Images in an electronic template intended to be used by third parties on electronic or
printed products, or where the purpose is to create “on-demand” products, including but not limited
to website designs, presentation templates, electronic greeting cards, business cards, t-shirts,
mugs, calendars, posters, screen-savers or wallpaper for mobile devices or any other electronic or
printed matter without obtaining a license for such purpose. For the avoidance of doubt, Images
may be incorporated into product packaging, merchandise for resale, or distribution where the
Image has been modified, incorporated in a design, or in a derivative form and is not used as a
stand-alone work for resale.

So according to this it may not be used in its entirety unless a specific license has been purchased but if you buy it in its web ready format you are able to modify it and incorporate it in a design which this author has done.  He is only using 10% of the image and its in the template theme design.

Robert Krausankas (BuddhaPi)

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Re: Extortion Letter from LCS
« Reply #5 on: December 18, 2015, 12:54:43 PM »
I'm fairly certain that theme developers do indeed offer their "code" under GPL, but this would not include "images".If it's a self hosted site, the site owner is responsible for content.. It's all very simple, if you used an image that you did not create, did not purchase a license for and it is not"public domain",chances are good you infringed...NEVER trust sites that offer "free" templates" "free themes" or "free images", as there isnot telling where they come from....IMHO 10% 50% or 100% doesn't really matter, nor does it really matter if you infrnged, it'snotthe end of the world by any means, the big question is how to proceed and just what exactly is LCS going to do...chances are they will just hound you and chances are less than 1% that the artist will file a lawsuit.
Most questions have already been addressed in the forums, get yourself educated before making decisions.

Any advice is strictly that, and anything I may state is based on my opinions, and observations.
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greg

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Re: Extortion Letter from LCS
« Reply #6 on: December 18, 2015, 01:36:37 PM »
All files included in themes hosted on WordPress.org fall into their GPL and require all images are able to be included in said theme.  So you are saying that if someone wants to use a theme in the WordPress repository they must take a look at every image file and see if there are any copyright infringements? I disagree and it is the authors responsibility.  I can understand it being the users if they modified the original theme and that is what the infringement is.

On the WordPress.org site regarding theme licensing it states: Themes are required to be 100% GPL-licensed, or use a GPL-compatible license. This includes all PHP, HTML, CSS, images, fonts, icons, and everything else. The complete theme must be GPL-Compatible.

Robert Krausankas (BuddhaPi)

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Re: Extortion Letter from LCS
« Reply #7 on: December 18, 2015, 04:08:32 PM »
I guess what i'm trying to say here, is that neither wordpress.org or .com is going to check to make sure everything is licensed properly, nor should they. They are leaving it up to the theme developers to be diligent and honest, which many are not, and many just don't care, especially those from foreign countries. They don't care about US copyright law. So WP having that in their "terms" most likely releases WP from any liability.. at the end of the day it's the end users who needs to be diligent. Also keep in mind these trolls target low hanging fruit that have no legal background and are not willing to fight back, it's a total money grab.

Getty did not care that the image I used was purchased in good faith, with a supplied license agreement, from someone who apparently swiped the image, then sold it.. I was still on the hook, but I fought back and flat out refused their demands.
Most questions have already been addressed in the forums, get yourself educated before making decisions.

Any advice is strictly that, and anything I may state is based on my opinions, and observations.
Robert Krausankas

I have a few friends around here..

Black Dog

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Re: Extortion Letter from LCS
« Reply #8 on: December 19, 2015, 09:34:56 PM »


Getty did not care that the image I used was purchased in good faith, with a supplied license agreement, from someone who apparently swiped the image, then sold it.. I was still on the hook, but I fought back and flat out refused their demands.

I received a letter from LCS recently and would be very interested in hearing more about your experience with Getty as I know they are "closely related".

greg

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Re: Extortion Letter from LCS
« Reply #9 on: December 20, 2015, 05:18:22 AM »
So after arguing the facts that I had, LCS has notified my that the case has been closed. The facts are that the theme was published on WordPress.org which requires its authors to publish any and all files contained in a theme to be GPL or be a GPL compatible license.  Also pointed out the fact that 500px Commercial Agreement license Section 3 says you must either talk with 500px to get approval and a further license payment to use the entire image. To quote this agreement, "For the avoidance of doubt, Images may be incorporated into product packaging, merchandise for resale, or distribution where the Image has been modified, incorporated in a design, or in a derivative form and is not used as a stand-alone work for resale."  In which the image they claimed was infringing on said image was not only modified but it was also incorporated into a design.

So where I agree with where you get your free resources can sometimes be an issue, but if you go with a reputable source like WordPress.org it can be better than just some random website claiming here are some free images.  WordPress.org goes a long way in trying to catch images and protect its users but no one is perfect.  I am glad WordPress.org has such requirements in all they do for the open source community.

  It can be scary to get an email saying either pay up or else but if you take your time and fight the good fight sometimes things come about how they should.  I consider this a win for David in the D vs G ever going battle. I appreciate this forum as it did help me gather my thoughts in how I was going to respond to this extortion letter. 

Robert Krausankas (BuddhaPi)

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Re: Extortion Letter from LCS
« Reply #10 on: December 20, 2015, 08:21:32 AM »
Great news Greg, just goes to show if one is willing to fight back for what is right, these assholes can be taken out! We see so many people simply cave, because they are either to afraid, ignorant or just plain lazy, which in turn just keeps the trolls in business.
Most questions have already been addressed in the forums, get yourself educated before making decisions.

Any advice is strictly that, and anything I may state is based on my opinions, and observations.
Robert Krausankas

I have a few friends around here..

Matthew Chan

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Re: Extortion Letter from LCS
« Reply #11 on: December 21, 2015, 03:38:01 PM »
The quick cheat to get educated is to treat LCS employees as if they were LCS employees and the LCS operation as if they were a Getty Images operation. The names may be different of the players but functionally identical. The exception is that LCS is making claims for other photographers and stock photo companies, not themselves.

Effectively, this makes LCS a bit more impotent and sterile than the main Getty Images operation. They are the slightly uglier stepchildren and inbred cousins of the overall operation. They likely trade information between the divisions and likely engage in a corporate incestuous operation. That is how closely related they are. They are likely boinking with each other (corporately).

I received a letter from LCS recently and would be very interested in hearing more about your experience with Getty as I know they are "closely related".
I'm a non-lawyer but not legally ignorant either. Under the 1st Amendment, I have the right to post facts & opinions using rhetorical hyperbole, colloquialisms, metaphors, parody, snark, or epithets. Under Section 230 of CDA, I'm only responsible for posts I write, not what others write.

 

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