ExtortionLetterInfo Forums

ELI Forums => Higbee Associates Letter & Lawsuits Forum => Topic started by: Karma on June 05, 2018, 09:30:57 PM

Title: Higbee Emails for supposed Stockfood America Image
Post by: Karma on June 05, 2018, 09:30:57 PM
Hi all - as a newbie, I want to thank Matthew and all for this forum. I recently received emails from the Higbee operation that are exactly like the ones that everyone else received, in the same order. I was wigged out enough at first to find this site, but now I feel totally comfortable ignoring them. I'll set up a folder to store them in as suggested, and continue on with life. Here are the sordid details:

Background: I have a tiny food business, which ceased operations in February.  I am dissolving that LLC - needless to say, all the assets have been sold and there is no money in the business.


Since reading this forum today, I looked up the number of unique users that have viewed the post.  13 unique users from the date of posting in September 2015 through yesterday, June 4, 2018. I could not find the image on usa.stockfood.com, but I did take screenshots of what similar pictures of mushrooms would cost. $29 for a digital image.

Thank you for being here, I feel comfortable ignoring Higbee at this point.
Title: Re: Higbee Emails for supposed Stockfood America Image
Post by: clist on June 05, 2018, 09:59:00 PM
You may want to proofread this post one more time.

Your business name is listed. 

8)
Title: Re: Higbee Emails for supposed Stockfood America Image
Post by: Karma on June 06, 2018, 12:50:38 AM
Thanks @clist! Though the funny thing is that isn't our correct business name - they couldn't even bother to find our business name on our home page LOL
Title: Re: Higbee Emails for supposed Stockfood America Image
Post by: icepick on June 07, 2018, 09:42:14 AM
It's been a while since I looked at Higbee letters, but this part right here:  If you have an attorney assisting you with this matter, please forward this communication to him or her.   If you do not have an attorney representing you, you may wish to hire one. does not sound familiar with what I've seen.

Can anyone with older letters confirm if this is a new addition to his letters? I'm intrigued at what likely forced its inclusion if it is new.
Title: Re: Higbee Emails for supposed Stockfood America Image
Post by: Matthew Chan on June 07, 2018, 12:46:45 PM
I need to go back and look for what you spotted.  In the absence of reading it myself, I will offer a speculation.

MOST lawyers are unfamiliar with the players in the business and the minutia and mechanisms being used to execute on these copyright extortion letters. Hence, lawyers will assume the worst and give not-so-good advice.  I have communicated with many folks who attempted to use a family lawyer, a friend lawyer, vanilla IP lawyer, and the horrific LegalShield/Prepaid Legal lawyers.  Most give bad advice not because of the legal interpretation. These unfamiliar lawyers (which clearly does NOT include Oscar Michelen) lack the background and knowledgebase we have on how the copyright extortion characters carry out their mission.

Non-lawyers are not expected nor are they required to follow professional legal conventions.  Many strategies we discuss on ELI make lawyers cringe. But I would challenge any lawyer to tell me that topics we discuss encourage criminal behavior.

Not all infringements are deserving of compensation even those with filed copyright registrations. It is an entitlement mentality adopted by the other side. There is a such thing as a "de minimus" infringement.  You know how I know? Because the big boys like Disney, movie studios, big publishers, don't issue extortion letters and demand money. All their works are trademarked, copyright registered, etc.  They have serious money and invest it to protect their IP.  They send cease and desist letters with a threat of possible litigation. They don't demand money. They just want you to stop using the image, video, etc.

Most of the parties demanding money are small timers.  They have Higbee and the like sell their narrative that all infringements require money to resolve. It is all bullshit. They might snow people who don't do their own research. But they don't snow me or other long time ELI loyalists. But lawyers who don't follow how copyright is enforced fall for the Higbee argument/propaganda.

Some examples of controversial strategies that make most lawyers cringe despite the fact they are legal (not a criminal act):

1. Avoid service
2. Letting a state dissolve your LLC.
3. Go Dark
4. Embark on an aggressive complaint letter campaign (credit to Greg Troy for this one) towards State Attorney General, BBB, State Bar, etc.
5. Don't respond/defend the matter, become uncollectible.
6. Play chicken.
7. Stand your ground.
8. Dox your opponents.
9. Be loud, aggressive, obnoxious, and vexatious.

Now keep in mind, I am not necessarily endorsing any of these strategies in themselves. Some are tools in a toolbox to be used surgically and strategically. I am the only guy I know that openly discuss these controversial strategies. Most lawyers will not generally discuss these options because they are generally against their code of professional conduct and ethics.

Non-lawyers have a lower bar of knowledge and expectations. My general opinion in dealing with these types of matters is that as long as people don't engage in criminal acts (such as threaten physical or bodily harm which is entirely off the table), most strategies are fair game.

By trying to convince defendants to show their letters to unfamiliar lawyers, the idea is to avoid unusual/controversial defense strategies and to turn an opposing lawyer into an unwitting ally.


Quote from: icepick on June 07, 2018, 09:42:14 AM
It's been a while since I looked at Higbee letters, but this part right here:  If you have an attorney assisting you with this matter, please forward this communication to him or her.   If you do not have an attorney representing you, you may wish to hire one. does not sound familiar with what I've seen.

Can anyone with older letters confirm if this is a new addition to his letters? I'm intrigued at what likely forced its inclusion if it is new.
Title: Re: Higbee Emails for supposed Stockfood America Image
Post by: Karma on June 07, 2018, 04:42:13 PM
Matt, thanks for the clear answer and the useful toolbox of things we can do. Love the idea that we can use them surgically and strategically.

I received the 5th email from Higbee today. This time they gave "Cheryl Supek" an email address instead of the generic claims - are they monitoring these forums? If so, I'm overjoyed they are taking my observations to heart. {Hi Higbee Swampsuckers! :-*} They seem to be reading the forum fairly closely, because this time they also attached the initial letter they claimed they sent via mail but was never received, and they also provided the image number which they had never done. Sloppy work Swampsuckers! This email came from Cheryl at csupek@higbeeassociates.com

Hello,

My name is Cheryl Supek,I am a Claim Resolution Specialist at the Law Firm of Higbee & Associates. My job is to help resolve copyright claims without them having to go to court.  I will be calling you soon to talk this claim and the letter that we mailed to you.  I have attached a copy of our initial demand letter for your review.

I am not one of the attorneys. I have about 14 days to try and resolve this claim before the claim gets escalated to the attorneys.  The claim gets more stressful and expensive when it gets moved to the attorneys— my goal is to not let that happen to you.

Here are a couple of things that can help solve this potential problem:

First, if you have a license for the image that was purchased prior to the image being used, please let me know and provide it to me via email.

Second, most business liability insurance policies cover this type of claim. Please contact your insurance provider and ask if they will cover this claim.

If you did not have a license or proper business insurance, we can talk about how to come to a reasonable resolution.  I will call you soon.

In the meantime, feel free to email me or call me on my direct line at 714-597-8996.






https://resolve.picrights.com/Templates/PreviewPdf?caseId=[REDACTED]&fileName=SOAStockFood%20SOA.pdf

https://resolve.picrights.com/Templates/PreviewPdf?caseId=[REDACTED]&fileName=RHFSigned.Stockfood.US



Page URL: [REDACTED]
Image URL: [REDACTED]



Our client is highly motivated to resolve this matter outside of litigation and willing to settle on this case with contingence on payment being made. Please be advise that this demands and warrants your immediate attention concerning this legal matter and resolving this within a timely manner will be suitable to avoid future penalties involved. Please let me know how you want to proceed.

Best Regards,



Cheryl Supek
Claims Resolution Specialist
Copyright Division

csupek@higbeeassociates.com
Law Offices of Higbee & Associates ( http://www.HigbeeAssociates.com )
1504 Brookhollow Dr. Suite 112, Santa Ana, CA. 92705
DIRECT PHONE: (714) 597-8996
Phone: (800) 716-1245 - Fax: (714) 597-6559







CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE:
The contents of this email message and any attachments are intended solely for the addressee(s) and may contain confidential and/or privileged information and may be legally protected from disclosure. If you are not the intended recipient of this message or their agent, or if this message has been addressed to you in error, please immediately alert the sender by reply email and then delete this message and any attachments. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination, copying, or storage of this message or its attachments is strictly prohibited.

Title: Re: Higbee Emails for supposed Stockfood America Image
Post by: Robert Krausankas (BuddhaPi) on June 07, 2018, 08:02:37 PM
This is great, that she has her own email address, social media can be a beautiful thing, or it can be ugly if you are on the wrong side... now that I have a name, maybe some doxxing is in order..
Title: Re: Higbee Emails for supposed Stockfood America Image
Post by: Ethan Seven on June 08, 2018, 12:35:10 AM
Quote from: Matthew Chan on June 07, 2018, 12:46:45 PM

Not all infringements are deserving of compensation even those with filed copyright registrations. It is an entitlement mentality adopted by the other side. There is a such thing as a "de minimus" infringement.  You know how I know? Because the big boys like Disney, movie studios, big publishers, don't issue extortion letters and demand money. All their works are trademarked, copyright registered, etc.  They have serious money and invest it to protect their IP.  They send cease and desist letters with a threat of possible litigation. They don't demand money. They just want you to stop using the image, video, etc.

I am a bit confused.  Are you saying there is a de minimum defense to copyright infringement?  I have heard of the extent of the infringement being used to calculate damages, but never as a defense to liability.

Some of your listed strategies would make me cringe too if the risks associated with them are not properly explained to someone considering them.  I am not sure what they all mean, but they are all 100 percent fine for someone who has nothing to lose, but to someone who has assets, a few of those tactics come with serious risk of making things worse by either inviting litigation and or increasing the chance a judge would award attorneys fees to the copyright holder and increase the award of damages.   

Sure, consider being creative or unconventional.  Options are good.  Just make sure you know that it if you have assets, it is possible to make things worse... heck, even much worse.   
Title: Re: Higbee Emails for supposed Stockfood America Image
Post by: icepick on June 08, 2018, 10:23:42 AM
I did go back and look at the letters I have access to from 2017 and that 'hire an attorney' paragraph was different. This is pure speculation on my part, but I don't see Higbee's operation rewriting that section voluntarily to suggest people get a legal opinion before paying him off. My best guess is someone with oversight authority took a look at his letters and told him he had to add something to that effect in it to avoid some kind of rule violation. Maybe a bar complaint or AG complaint somewhere made some progress and hopefully he gets to critical mass soon.
Title: Re: Higbee Emails for supposed Stockfood America Image
Post by: Matthew Chan on June 08, 2018, 01:38:43 PM
NO, I do not believe there is a "formal defense" per se but as you say it is an argument to make when someone tries false inflate a value of an infringement. And it is also a perfectly legitimate settlement discussion point and defense. Making an argument does not require an agreement.

 In my view, it is applicable to situations where there is no copyright registration.  It is a fact that many infringements do not result in money demands because of the "de minimus" argument. "It ain't worth it".

And my "list of strategies" was meant to give some specificity of what I consider controversial and cringe-inducing. I did write a disclaimer.  ... keep in mind, I am not necessarily endorsing any of these strategies in themselves. Some are tools in a toolbox to be used surgically and strategically.

I am not going to get into all the ins and outs of what I think and how certain controversial tactics should be used. I don't get paid enough to write freely in detail and how and what I think. I keep threatening to write a book on the subject and maybe I will one day. Meanwhile, people who really want to know what I think either has to be a good friend in business or they will have to pay for my consulting time. But I stand by my assertions. I don't limit myself to "traditional" tactics. If I did, ELI would not have been born nearly 10 years ago.  ELI is living proof that unconventional tactics work in fighting back. Oscar Michelen supports ELI and continues to be a legal advisor because he saw early on how effective unconventional tactics worked.

And this whole notion that because someone has assets needs to bend over and take it up the rear is something I don't accept. It is a factor for consideration, not a determining factor. People who have assets can definitely fight back too. If you don't believe it, you are not looking hard enough. You and I will have to agree to disagree. The limiting factor is generally the person in the driver's seat.

Sometimes it isn't about the money. Sometimes it is about the principle, punchback, and not letting someone fleece you. For some people, fighting back, it is all about the money. For me, sometimes it is about the principle.


Quote from: Ethan Seven on June 08, 2018, 12:35:10 AM
I am a bit confused.  Are you saying there is a de minimum defense to copyright infringement?  I have heard of the extent of the infringement being used to calculate damages, but never as a defense to liability.

Some of your listed strategies would make me cringe too if the risks associated with them are not properly explained to someone considering them.  I am not sure what they all mean, but they are all 100 percent fine for someone who has nothing to lose, but to someone who has assets, a few of those tactics come with serious risk of making things worse by either inviting litigation and or increasing the chance a judge would award attorneys fees to the copyright holder and increase the award of damages.   

Sure, consider being creative or unconventional.  Options are good.  Just make sure you know that it if you have assets, it is possible to make things worse... heck, even much worse.
Title: Re: Higbee Emails for supposed Stockfood America Image
Post by: Ethan Seven on June 08, 2018, 01:47:44 PM
You could be right IcePick, but my guess is that the change in language is a psychological ploy.  The language projects confidence and infers a seriousness to the matter.   If they send a lot of letters, my guess is that they test the language and that the language of letters reflect the test results.  Do they use the exact same language for different clients?  It is also possible that the client exercises some control.

Also, I am not aware of any state having a rule of professional conduct that requires a prelitigation letter to state the obvious fact that a person may wish to hire an attorney.   Do you know of any that do?    My guess might be colored by the fact that I also am very skeptical about complaints to regulatory agencies having any impact on situations like this, other than making the attorney focus more on the claim. 
Title: Re: Higbee Emails for supposed Stockfood America Image
Post by: Ethan Seven on June 08, 2018, 02:07:51 PM
 

Quote from: Matthew Chan on June 08, 2018, 01:38:43 PM
In my view, it is applicable to situations where there is no copyright registration.  It is a fact that many infringements do not result in money demands because of the "de minimus" argument. "It ain't worth it".



And this whole notion that because someone has assets needs to bend over and take it up the rear is something I don't accept. It is a factor for consideration, not a determining factor. People who have assets can definitely fight back too. If you don't believe it, you are not looking hard enough. You and I will have to agree to disagree.


I agree that arguing de minus is always appropriate as to limit damages.  Readers just need to know that it is not a defense to copyright infringement.

I am not sure if you are trying to infer that I said those with assets should not fight, but that is clearly NOT my position.  I think those with assets should produce a license or assert a valid defense if they have one. If they have neither, they should hire an attorney who can explain the risks and help them fight.
Title: Re: Higbee Emails for supposed Stockfood America Image
Post by: Matthew Chan on June 08, 2018, 02:15:17 PM
Attorney Tim McCormack (who used to represent Getty Images), and a few other lawyers all left the extortion letter business because of a collective campaign of complaint letters to state bars and Attorney Generals against them over the years. Even Getty Images changed their ways because the Washington State Attorney General forwarded complaints to Getty Images for them to respond. I think it became a very annoying experience for them.

A few lawyers did not like that ELI readers were writing and complaining on this forum that specific lawyers were "extortionists" and that their names even APPEARED in a website named "extortionletterinfo" help motivate them to leave the business. Some lawyers like Higbee in California, Sanders in New York, and California lawyer Leslie Burns appear to have thicker skin and understand what they have to deal with being in the extortion letter industry. So, it doesn't run everyone off.

These actions we discuss cause a great deal of inconvenience and upset (collateral damage) to the would-be "threateners". Even the mighty Getty Images have changed their ways. Getty settlement demands are much lower than they used to be. We hardly hear from people complaining anymore. They didn't just change their ways because they one day decided to become nice guys. They changed because the collateral damage they experienced on several fronts took a toll on them. Again, I am not going to outline every single thing ELI discusses but suffice to say time has shown that a lot of our unconventional discussions have been very effective at pushing back.

Readers who immerse themselves into ELI readings will figure out that adopting a PITA (pain-in-the-ass) attitude in defending themselves as part of larger group will do much better than being a lone obedient follower.


Quote from: Ethan Seven on June 08, 2018, 01:47:44 PM
I also am very skeptical about complaints to regulatory agencies having any impact on situations like this, other than making the attorney focus more on the claim.
Title: Re: Higbee Emails for supposed Stockfood America Image
Post by: Matthew Chan on June 08, 2018, 02:31:20 PM
People with assets DO have unconventional tools, tactics, and strategies (some cringe worthy) to use but that is something I generally prefer not to discuss publicly because I think it will be taken out of context.  I keep certain things close to the vest.  People with assets typically are not the underdogs in many extortion letter situations so I am not as worried about those folks.

I have the good fortune of having had access to various people in various legal positions over the years. Some people will share things with me things that they would not otherwise discuss with the general public. Part of that is because I have more insights than the average bear on legal matters and procedures. Hence, they are more open with me.  The average non-lawyer with no street experience has low level of understanding which is why they get rolled over and they can only accept simplistic advice.

This is one reason why I keep telling victims to get educated. If they have a low-level understanding, the only information they can ever accept is low-fidelity advice.

 I have seen a bit of the underbelly of the legal system and its VERY HUMAN participants. I also know "how things work on the streets" which is very useful in many circumstance. 

Quote from: Ethan Seven on June 08, 2018, 02:07:51 PM
I agree that arguing de minus is always appropriate as to limit damages.  Readers just need to know that it is not a defense to copyright infringement.

I am not sure if you are trying to infer that I said those with assets should not fight, but that is clearly NOT my position.  I think those with assets should produce a license or assert a valid defense if they have one. If they have neither, they should hire an attorney who can explain the risks and help them fight.
Title: Re: Higbee Emails for supposed Stockfood America Image
Post by: Ethan Seven on June 08, 2018, 02:45:58 PM
I would like to think this forum could impact large scale change.  I am sure it can help on an individual basis.  However, are you sure you are not confusing cause with corollation or coincidence?

Attorney Timothy McCormack has no public record of discipline from the Washington State Bar, neither does Higbee (admittedly,  I only checked CA Andy he is admitted in about 10 states).

Usually state bar associations let the complaintant know the outcome of the complaint.    My guess is that if the complaintants were getting good results, they would be posting on this forum. Do you have any evidence or feedback that shows any adverse action was taken on a complaint to a state bar?

If a state bar reviews a complaint and finds no violation of the rules, my guess is that all similar letters received in the future go nowhere; the attorney probably does not even get made aware of them. 

I know nothing about what drive Getty’s business decisions.
Title: Re: Higbee Emails for supposed Stockfood America Image
Post by: icepick on June 08, 2018, 04:18:54 PM
It is possible, but it appears very counter-intuitive. Higbee wants people to send in a check and don't ask questions. The more time he spends on a case without getting that check equals his investment and risk of unpaid time going up. The last thing he wants is his target getting informed, independent (hopefully competent) legal advice. It certainly struck me as an odd addition to his letter and one I do not think he made of his own volition.

I've raised points on some of the rules Higbee may be skirting the edges of in other posts if you want more info, but the biggest gray area he faces is any kind of conduct involving "dishonesty, fraud, deceit or misrepresentation" is a potential violation in certain states he is licensed in, not all. It has no bearing if the communication is pre-litigation or not, it covers all conduct of any type at any time to anyone. A bar overseer reading his blustery letters without a disclaimer that you may want to consult an attorney since I'm threatening the end of the world on you could see an issue.

His letters also have him playing good cop/bad cop at the same time and that can create the impression to the recipient that he is giving them advice when he is their adversary. That confusion can be a perceived conflict of interest and another avenue of violation that an overseer would want him to clarify with the 'speak to an attorney' line.

It's just a theory. I will certainly watch Higbee's career unfold with great interest.

Quote from: Ethan Seven on June 08, 2018, 01:47:44 PM
You could be right IcePick, but my guess is that the change in language is a psychological ploy.  The language projects confidence and infers a seriousness to the matter.   If they send a lot of letters, my guess is that they test the language and that the language of letters reflect the test results.  Do they use the exact same language for different clients?  It is also possible that the client exercises some control.

Also, I am not aware of any state having a rule of professional conduct that requires a prelitigation letter to state the obvious fact that a person may wish to hire an attorney.   Do you know of any that do?    My guess might be colored by the fact that I also am very skeptical about complaints to regulatory agencies having any impact on situations like this, other than making the attorney focus more on the claim.
Title: Re: Higbee Emails for supposed Stockfood America Image
Post by: clist on June 08, 2018, 05:48:35 PM
Quote from: icepick on June 08, 2018, 04:18:54 PM
...A bar overseer reading his blustery letters without a disclaimer that you may want to consult an attorney since I'm threatening the end of the world on you could see an issue.

His letters also have him playing good cop/bad cop at the same time and that can create the impression to the recipient that he is giving them advice when he is their adversary. That confusion can be a perceived conflict of interest and another avenue of violation that an overseer would want him to clarify with the 'speak to an attorney' line...


 8)
Title: Re: Higbee Emails for supposed Stockfood America Image
Post by: omlov21 on June 10, 2018, 01:50:43 PM
Quote from: Karma on June 05, 2018, 09:30:57 PM
If you have a license for the images, please provide me information and accept my apology for the intrusion.

I wanted to comment on something I saw in your first post in item number 3.  The person is basically saying you are guilty and owe a lot for damages but if for some unforeseen reason you just happen to have a license for the image please provide it and accept their apology? 

What kind of amateurs does Higbee have working for them that they are willing to throw out rather serious allegations without being 100% sure said person does not have a license for the images?  That's like insulting a female coworkers husband at work without ever having met him and not knowing if he's a 6'3 250 lbs UFC fighter ready to pound your a$$ 6 feet under only later to apologize later because you didn't know he was a UFC fighter.

This makes me believe they are trying hard over and over again with their letters to get some type of response from you by an amateur "client resolution specialist".  They are probably trained to write the letters such that the chance of a received response is greater.  I imagine no response from the get go is the worst as they have to put a lot more resources to find out if they even have a case, and how could they be 100% sure this person does not have a license?  Higbee probably hires a bunch of lower paid employees with no real experience in the legal field and does a quick training and let's them draft these letters.  I bet his upper management reviews their performance over a few months to see how effective they are in getting people to fork over money and maybe even pay them commision based.  He probably doesn't even review these letters himself and doesn't get involved until a case is recommended for filing.  Let me also comment that I looked up the name of one of these "client resolution specialists" working at his firm and it looked like this person had a lot of non-legal experience in industry doing admin stuff prior to joining the Higbee racket.  Higbee probably wants to maximize ROI vs. paying a more expensive paralegal.  Anyone else think this is possible?

This brings me to my next point.  What if someone purchases a license using their DBA (doing business as name), but their company is actually called or registered under something different?  Are there any regulations that would cause that license to be invalid if hosted on that website by a sole proprietor?  This is where their approach could really backfire on them if they haven't done their due diligence to find out who really owns the website and how that license was purchased.  This is maybe why they try so hard to get some type of response by drafting the letters the way they do.  No response maybe gives them to much risk for suing a company or person with little info that can be easily obtained.

For people who can dig deeper and learn mind tricks people play, to me it seems that letter just revealed a flaw in their approach that most people wouldn't catch.
Title: Re: Higbee Emails for supposed Stockfood America Image
Post by: omlov21 on June 10, 2018, 01:58:13 PM
Quote from: icepick on June 08, 2018, 04:18:54 PM
His letters also have him playing good cop/bad cop at the same time and that can create the impression to the recipient that he is giving them advice when he is their adversary. That confusion can be a perceived conflict of interest and another avenue of violation that an overseer would want him to clarify with the 'speak to an attorney' line.

Here's my theory, it could be to add some authenticity to the letter so people don't just discard it as a scam and throw it away and ignore.  No response is probably the worst outcome for Higbee as it means much more work for them to find out any information.

Also, maybe Higbee figured out most people will start to panic when they see the word "attorney" and will cause people to think the case is extremely serious.  Most people would then think about the high cost of hiring an attorney and assume its cheaper to just negotiate and settle with them and get it over with.  The "you might want to hire an attorney" may cause some people to go crazy as most perceive that as a serious threat or that they are in really hot water.  Let's be honest, most of the people getting these letters may not be the fighting type so it will freak out a lot of people.

They must have done some statistics on which letters bring in money and which ones don't.  A lot of them seem to have some similarities and they probably have template letters people modify and metrics on what works the best for certain people.  I'm sure that Higbee has a data analyst he hired as a summer intern, etc doing some studies on which letters bring in the most money and is maybe providing some guidance to these "client resolution specialists" who are drafting the letters. 

It's like Higbee wants to be the Amazon Inc. of  copyright trolling with his fancy pay online portal and having low paid workers with no real qualifications.  If he could figure out how to make his "client resolution specialists" have just a first name and last initial like Cheryl H. like Amazon does, he'd be right on par.  I'm sure other lawyers in the industry would poke fun at the types of people he has working for him if they looked up who these "client resolution specialists" are.  However if he had these people use just a first name and last initial to keep them anonymous on the letters/emails sent out, people might perceive them as scams. 
Title: Re: Higbee Emails for supposed Stockfood America Image
Post by: Matthew Chan on June 11, 2018, 05:37:32 PM
I never said McCormack had any record of discipline. I said there were complaint letters sent to the State Bar about him. I know this because both Getty Images and McCormack himself stated it in writing in non-public documents we have. I am not going to elaborate on that except to say what we have was very legally obtained.

The State Bars I am familiar with do contact the lawyers and they generally are required to respond. And regardless of outcome, they do make an impact on the person being complained about.

I am not going to draw a straight line about why it works and the impact it has. The general public may not see the impact but it does have impact. If you think that official "adverse action" is the only thing that matters to a lawyer and it goes "nowhere", you are obviously not getting what I am saying.

Your comments continue to suggest you think ELI resistance is all about legalistic tactics and strategies. As so many ELI posts suggest, we don't limit discussions to the legal arena.

There are many things creative non-lawyers can do and have done successfully. But it always comes down to the person.

Quote from: Ethan Seven on June 08, 2018, 02:45:58 PM
Attorney Timothy McCormack has no public record of discipline from the Washington State Bar, neither does Higbee (admittedly,  I only checked CA Andy he is admitted in about 10 states).

Usually state bar associations let the complaintant know the outcome of the complaint.  My guess is that if the complaintants were getting good results, they would be posting on this forum. Do you have any evidence or feedback that shows any adverse action was taken on a complaint to a state bar?

If a state bar reviews a complaint and finds no violation of the rules, my guess is that all similar letters received in the future go nowhere; the attorney probably does not even get made aware of them. 
Title: Re: Higbee Emails for supposed Stockfood America Image
Post by: Matthew Chan on June 11, 2018, 05:45:31 PM
Icepick makes a lot of great points here. Higbee and their ilk like simplistic-thinking victims who view things black and white. They are much easier prey to go after.

They hate out-of-the-box thinkers, fighters, and resistors.

Quote from: icepick on June 08, 2018, 04:18:54 PM
It is possible, but it appears very counter-intuitive. Higbee wants people to send in a check and don't ask questions. The more time he spends on a case without getting that check equals his investment and risk of unpaid time going up. The last thing he wants is his target getting informed, independent (hopefully competent) legal advice. It certainly struck me as an odd addition to his letter and one I do not think he made of his own volition.

I've raised points on some of the rules Higbee may be skirting the edges of in other posts if you want more info, but the biggest gray area he faces is any kind of conduct involving "dishonesty, fraud, deceit or misrepresentation" is a potential violation in certain states he is licensed in, not all. It has no bearing if the communication is pre-litigation or not, it covers all conduct of any type at any time to anyone. A bar overseer reading his blustery letters without a disclaimer that you may want to consult an attorney since I'm threatening the end of the world on you could see an issue.

His letters also have him playing good cop/bad cop at the same time and that can create the impression to the recipient that he is giving them advice when he is their adversary. That confusion can be a perceived conflict of interest and another avenue of violation that an overseer would want him to clarify with the 'speak to an attorney' line.

It's just a theory. I will certainly watch Higbee's career unfold with great interest.
Title: Re: Higbee Emails for supposed Stockfood America Image
Post by: Matthew Chan on June 11, 2018, 05:53:46 PM
My comments inline...

Quote from: omlov21 on June 10, 2018, 01:50:43 PM
This makes me believe they are trying hard over and over again with their letters to get some type of response from you by an amateur "client resolution specialist".  They are probably trained to write the letters such that the chance of a received response is greater.  I imagine no response from the get go is the worst as they have to put a lot more resources to find out if they even have a case, and how could they be 100% sure this person does not have a license?  Higbee probably hires a bunch of lower paid employees with no real experience in the legal field and does a quick training and let's them draft these letters.  I bet his upper management reviews their performance over a few months to see how effective they are in getting people to fork over money and maybe even pay them commision based.  He probably doesn't even review these letters himself and doesn't get involved until a case is recommended for filing.  Let me also comment that I looked up the name of one of these "client resolution specialists" working at his firm and it looked like this person had a lot of non-legal experience in industry doing admin stuff prior to joining the Higbee racket.  Higbee probably wants to maximize ROI vs. paying a more expensive paralegal.  Anyone else think this is possible?

Absolutely correct. In Higbee's case, the first-responders are lower-paid, non-lawyers (whom I refer to as clerks) whom I believe are compensated by an hourly wage with a bonus incentive attached. Their clerks admit they are not lawyers and their job is to try to secure a settlement prior to "escalation". 

This is where their approach could really backfire on them if they haven't done their due diligence to find out who really owns the website and how that license was purchased.  This is maybe why they try so hard to get some type of response by drafting the letters the way they do.  No response maybe gives them to much risk for suing a company or person with little info that can be easily obtained.

Again, you are on point and insightful. Their letters are designed to be "overwhelming" and "definitive". However, the educated, experienced, and informed understand it is neither overwhelming or definitive. It is largely a fishing expedition. And make no mistake, the obedient, compliant, low-hanging fruit are the ones who are most victimized vs. the people who are committed, informed, and resistant.

For people who can dig deeper and learn mind tricks people play, to me it seems that letter just revealed a flaw in their approach that most people wouldn't catch.

Absolutely correct.
Title: Re: Higbee Emails for supposed Stockfood America Image
Post by: Karma on June 12, 2018, 05:06:07 PM
Has anyone seen this article from Fast Company? It says clients pay to use Higbee's "proven" letter templates, and they then pay Higbee 50% of all settlements.

https://www.fastcompany.com/40494777/here-come-the-copyright-robots-for-hire-with-lawyers-in-tow
Title: Re: Higbee Emails for supposed Stockfood America Image
Post by: Matthew Chan on June 13, 2018, 03:32:57 PM
Yes, we have seen it.  It was an interesting article.  Of course, Higbee got in his quotes which serves his narrative which I don't agree with.  If things were so clear and obvious, there would be little need for an ongoing, relentless extortion letter campaign calling, begging, pleading, threatening, cajoling, and manipulating people to settle.

Quote from: Karma on June 12, 2018, 05:06:07 PM
Has anyone seen this article from Fast Company? It says clients pay to use Higbee's "proven" letter templates, and they then pay Higbee 50% of all settlements.

https://www.fastcompany.com/40494777/here-come-the-copyright-robots-for-hire-with-lawyers-in-tow