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Messages - codeman

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1
UK Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Getty Images Letter
« on: March 08, 2017, 04:14:05 PM »
I would just ignore them, they are hoping you are will get stressed and panic with their artificially tight deadlines and that you will just hand over your money without a fight which is what they want after all if they can convince you to hand over £750 for the cost of a couple of letters that is a real win for them.

They do not care about you or the stress they cause they just want your money they are not doing from some high moral stance to protect the rights of the photographer.

You have not committed infringement, they may claim that you have committed an infringement but only a court of law can make that determination.

It is up to them to prove that you have infringed and that can only be done in court, it is not up to you to prove your innocence.

If you were to contact them and ask for proof that they are allowed to manage image on behalf of the owner and did not supply it then one has to assume they do not have the necessary documentation.

If it did go to court which is highly unlikely the fact that they did not supply the information when requested it would be looked on unfavourably by the judge.

Consider if I emailed you out of the blue and claimed that you had used one of my images and that you owned me £1000 pounds would you pay me the money, of course you would not, least ways not without some kind of proof.

One thing you have realise is that Getty is not an honest or reputable organisation as has been shown on many occasions.

Just because they point out that the image is on their website does not mean that they have the copyright or the rights to manage the image, you only have to look to the infringement claim Getty made against the Carol Highsmith accusing her of infringement by displaying one of their images on her website.

They really did screw up there as Carol Highsmith was the photographer who took the photograph and she donates her pictures to the American Library of Congress royalty free.

So they claimed they owned image that did not belong to them because it was on their website  and attempted to extort money from the photographer who took the image.

It would have been great to see them get stuffed in court but unfortunately it was settled.

Getty will probably lose interest quickly if you do not communicate with them and they will get Attradius to try and frighten the money out of you.

However Attradius can do nothing as it is not a debt simply a claim, they may make a nuisance of themselves phoning you up demanding the money claiming you have committed copyright infringement but as it has not been proved in court they can do nothing.

If they do call just tell them you will not discuss it until you have spoken to your solicitor and keep saying that to every question they ask (it drives them crazy), do not try and attempt to get into a discussion as that is what they want, they will then try and wear you down to get the money out of you.

JUST ANSWER EVERY QUESTION AND I MEAN EVERY QUESTION THEY ASK EVEN IF IT IS ABOUT THE WEATHER WITH 'I NEED TO DISCUSS THAT WITH MY SOLICITOR' THEY WILL REALISE THAT YOU ARE AN AWKWARD BUGGER WHO IS NOT GOING TO GIVE UP WITHOUT A FIGHT.

Remember the more time they waste trying to get money out of you the less profit they make, so make it expensive to deal with you, a good trick is to demand paper copies of the documents.

With paper copies you can say they did not arrive so eventually they would have to send them recorded delivery (more expensive).

Do not communicate with them by email as that costs almost nothing, just use the argument that you want a proper paper trail with any accompanying correspondence.

They me phoned three times and I just stonewalled them so I guess they gave up with me and went to chase someone else who might be easier and cheaper to get the money out of.

Your best defence is to get educated about this by reading the ELI forums.




2
UK Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Getty Images Letter
« on: March 07, 2017, 03:36:57 PM »
I wrote this response to other folks in your situation a while back.

Firstly take a deep breath and don't panic.

I had a letter from Getty demanding over over a £1000 for a small poor resolution image over a about 4 years ago.

My advice is do not respond to the email/letter because if you do they know they have hooked a live one, Getty do not care about any mitigating circumstances they are just after your money and send the settlement demand letter to scare you into giving them money without any proof they have the copyright of the image.

They do not charge an average fee as they have claimed they bump up the price to try and screw you for every penny they can, in my case they were asking 10 times the actual license cost.

Bear in mind it is up to them to prove that you have infringed and to do that it would have to go to court, don't do their work for them by admitting anything in writing, email or by telephone.

Before paying anything they would have to prove to you that they own the copyright or the exclusive rights to mange it, therefore demand that they provide you a copy of the agreement between themselves and the photographer (redacted only where necessary).

If you have to put anything in writing make sure you send it recorded delivery and unless they send letter to you recorded delivery I would ignore them.

They set an artificial deadline to panic you into paying up under threat of legal action, the best thing you can do is slow the process down and makes it more expensive for them and therefore not worth pursuing.

If you ignore their letter they will eventually pass it to a debt collection agency (Attradius) to further try and intimidate you into paying up but as it is not a debt they cannot do anything.

When Attradius contacted me by phone I said I was not prepared to discuss until I had spoken to a solicitor however these people are trained to trip you up and get you to agree to pay the money (they get a cut of it if you pay up) so stonewall them and make it as expensive as possible to chase you.

The only response to every question they asked was responded to with the same answer, they will keep on and on trying to wear you down but all you have to do is stonewall them with 'I will have to discuss this with my solicitor'.

The last contact I had from them was nearly three years ago.

Like you I was worried sick when I got a letter from these reptiles but after reading up on these forums I realized that Getty is trying it on, remember they have never successfully sued, although they like to give the impression they have.

Remember don't panic and don't get stressed over it.

6
Firstly take a deep breath and don't panic.

I had a letter from Getty demanding over over a £1000 for a small poor resolution image over a couple of years ago.

My advice is do not respond to the email/letter because if you do they know they have hooked a live one, Getty do not care about any mitigating circumstances they are just after your money and send the settlement demand letter to scare you into giving them money without any proof they have the copyright of the image.

They do not charge an average fee as they have claimed they bump up the price to try and screw you for every penny they can, in my case they were asking 10 times the actual license cost.

Bear in mind it is up to them to prove that you have infringed and to do that it would have to go to court, don't do their work for them by admitting anything in writing, email or by telephone.

Before paying anything they would have to prove to you that they own the copyright or the exclusive rights to mange it, therefore demand that they provide you a copy of the agreement between themselves and the photographer (redacted only where necessary).

If you have to put anything in writing make sure you send it recorded delivery and unless they send letter to you recorded delivery I would ignore them.

They set an artificial deadline to panic you into paying up under threat of legal action, the best thing you can do is slow the process down and makes it more expensive for them and therefore not worth pursuing.

If you ignore their letter they will eventually pass it to a debt collection agency (Attradius) to further try and intimidate you into paying up but as it is not a debt they cannot do anything.

When Attradius contacted me I said I was not prepared to discuss until I had spoken to a solicitor however these people are trained to trip you up and get you to agree to pay the money (they get a cut of it if you pay up) so stonewall them and make it as expensive as possible to chase you.

The only response to every question they asked was responded to with the same answer, they will keep on and on trying to wear you down but all you have to do is stonewall them with 'I will have to discuss this with my solicitor'.

The last contact I had from them was over a year ago.

Like you I was worried sick when I got a letter from these reptiles but after reading up on these forums I realized that Getty is trying it on, remember they have never successfully sued, although they like to give the impression they have.

Remember don't panic and don't get stressed over it.

7
Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Another Getty Image Story
« on: April 22, 2015, 03:15:44 PM »
They only had my phone number and unfortunately I was out when they called and they managed to get my wife to confirm our address.

They called back and I told them I would only communicate using written documentation which they sent and I ignored.

They called back and I told them I had not received it so they sent another copy recorded and then  called a couple of weeks after that at which point I went into my stonewall routine.

I think they called a total of three times and that was over a year ago and I have not heard from them since ( I guess they think I am going to be an awkward so and so and moved on to easier targets ).

They are persistent but don't let that worry you as they are a debt collection agency and you have not incurred a debt so they are unable to collect anything despite how much of a threatening tone they use.


8
Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Another Getty Image Story
« on: April 22, 2015, 06:13:17 AM »
I would not respond to them at all.

If they communicate with you simply reply that you will only accept written forms of communication  and will not discuss the matter using email or by telephone.

This slows the whole process down and starts to make it more expensive for them to continue chasing you.

Eventually they will probably get a company called Atradius to chase you for the money.

Atradius telephoned me claiming that I owed Getty money to which I replied I did not know what they were talking about and wanted written documentation before I would discuss this matter any further and put the phone down.

I ignored their first letter so they resorted to sending another recorded delivery (more expensive for them and again slowing the process down again).

When they phoned me after that I said that I was going to contact my solicitor for legal advice, every question the Atradius representative asked I stonewalled them by saying I  was not prepared to discuss the matter until I had received legal advice which also prevented them from getting information from me that they may try and use against at a later time.

Do not try and discuss it over the phone with these people as they are trained to extract information from you and to try and get you to agree to something under pressure.

I have not heard from them in over year and I certainly am not worried anymore.

Remember that is their job to try and get the money and it is not in your interest to make it easy for them.

Regards

Codeman


9
I thought this news item I found on ZDNET might be of interest to the ELI forum members.

http://www.zdnet.com/getty-images-sues-microsoft-for-massive-infringement-over-image-search-tool-7000033327/


10
As Attradius are a member of the Credit Services Association they have to comply with the CSA code of practice.

A quick look at the code of practice turns up this paragraph which may be of interest, I have highlighted the phrase of interest.


1.   Key Requirements
        Every member shall
.
.
s: make contact at reasonable times and at reasonable intervals,
   taking into consideration the reasonable wishes of the debtor,
   which may include the preferred method of communication
. Where
   possible, make debtors aware of business opening times and
   highlight contact periods
.
.

11
Thanks Robert,

As I said I have no intention of contacting Getty if I can possibly avoid it, as far as I am concerned I am going to try and make life as difficult for them as I possibly can if only because of their heavy handed approach.

I am guessing the next step is they will try and set debt a collection agency on me, however armed with some of the information I have found on this forum and other places on the web I will be ready for any debt collection agency.

I only asked about the address for contacting Getty because the letter appears to originate from a business park in Ireland but the settlement demand has a London address (101 Bayham Street).

As far as I am concerned if the settlement demand has a London address then it would be the London address one would contact.

I am really just trying to do some preliminary research to make sure of some facts before things start to get messy.

As I said I am not going to contact them as I want them to do all the work.

I will of course keep this forum informed of events as and when they occur.




12
While not intending to contact Getty unless I have to it would be useful to know where mail to Getty should be addressed to.

I think the letter they sent is designed to obfuscate a real contact address and confuse the recipient.

If anyone could provide advice on this it would be appreciated.

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