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Author Topic: Has anyone in the UK settled?  (Read 6091 times)

Lottie

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Has anyone in the UK settled?
« on: July 25, 2012, 06:13:59 PM »
Hi there, like most we received a letter in early 2010, we removed the image and ignored the letter. We got a final notice letter in June 2010 then again in mid 2011. A solicitors letter was sent and we heard nothing until about 3 weeks ago.

The matter has been handed to a debt recovery company, Atradius. They have threatened court action if we don't pay within 5 days. We made a without prejudice offer without admitting liability of £25 which has been rejected. The demand is for £800 + VAT = £968

Has anyone out there settled with Atradius/Getty and if so, how much for?   
many thanks in advance for your info on this


Robert Krausankas (BuddhaPi)

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Re: Has anyone in the UK settled?
« Reply #1 on: July 25, 2012, 06:28:39 PM »
This collection Agency has no right to attempt to collect on a "claim", you  will have to research how this works in the UK, but i'm sure it is not ethical and probably not legal..search this forum for other threads related to this collection agency, you might find your answer...Once you get them to return the claim to Getty, they will be off your back.. I don't know what the statute of limitations is in the UK, but here it is 3 years, which you are nearing..if it is the same in the UK, you could easily go back and forth with Getty for the remainder of the statute at which point it passes you can politely tell them to pound salt...you'd be in the clear then..
Most questions have already been addressed in the forums, get yourself educated before making decisions.

Any advice is strictly that, and anything I may state is based on my opinions, and observations.
Robert Krausankas

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Lottie

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Re: Has anyone in the UK settled?
« Reply #2 on: July 25, 2012, 06:49:06 PM »
Thanks for the advice.

As for statute of limitations, from what I gather most are 6 years in the UK. I assume it would be for this too.

Robert Krausankas (BuddhaPi)

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Re: Has anyone in the UK settled?
« Reply #3 on: July 25, 2012, 06:58:33 PM »
I think it would be in your best interest to NOT ASSUME it is 6 yrs.. if it is only three you are almost home free..it should not be hard to find and the answer is most likely right in these forums. We're willing to help, but you have to be willing to do some of the homework as well.. I'm hoping another UK poster will chime in with the answer, bu t I know for a fact that this collection agency just came to our attention recently and I also know there was some discussion..you might want to start there and see if anyone chimes in with the statute..
Most questions have already been addressed in the forums, get yourself educated before making decisions.

Any advice is strictly that, and anything I may state is based on my opinions, and observations.
Robert Krausankas

I have a few friends around here..

gettyhater

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Re: Has anyone in the UK settled?
« Reply #4 on: July 26, 2012, 09:22:40 AM »
My client is in the same situation as yourself. I have sent letters to Atradius to get them to answer some very basic questions are they always seem to avoid reaching the point i am asking. This is their last reponse from 23rd July in which i sent them two letters asking the questions below:

We have already answered you queries however to avoid any further questions please note below.
 
1.   Getty’s legal bond/proof of rights instruction with the image owner to recover any infringement charges.
 
This is clearly covered in the letters sent and is covered under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988.
 
2.   Image owner to provide exclusive copyright details of the image.
 
Our clients images are encoded with a marker which is identifiable with their software, When their images are located the details are cross referenced against their database of clients and if there is not a match a letter is sent to the websites owner. Hence we can prove the image you used belongs to Getty Images.
 
3.   Explanation and breakdown as to how the amount of £574.75 was calculated as a legal charge.
 
The charge made is for an infringement. There is no breakdown. You have used our clients image without obtaining the rights and therefore are being invoiced as they deem fit. You may wish to refer to a case earlier this year HOFFMAN v DRUG ABUSE RESISTANCE EDUCATION (UK) LTD for clarification of charges being made and awarded.
 
4.   If Getty Images are exclusive licensees for this image, then please provide license.
 
If you wish to use the image legally then you must first pay the settlement requested for using the image without authorisation. You can then be supplied with a figure for use of the image once details of the image use have been taken.
 
As we have fully responded to each point you have raised please confirm that payment of the £574.75 will be made immediately. If payment is not made we will have no option but to pursue the end user for the amount whereby court action will be taken if payment is not received.
----

Question 4 is the question which i think they deliberately avoided answering. I am now going to wait and see how long it takes for them to send my client another letter. They have given deadlines firstly of 14days, then 5 days so will see what case they have and if they send any other threating letters.

Robert Krausankas (BuddhaPi)

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Re: Has anyone in the UK settled?
« Reply #5 on: July 26, 2012, 10:34:35 AM »
see my comments in the quoted portion of this in bold type.

My client is in the same situation as yourself. I have sent letters to Atradius to get them to answer some very basic questions are they always seem to avoid reaching the point i am asking. This is their last reponse from 23rd July in which i sent them two letters asking the questions below:

We have already answered you queries however to avoid any further questions please note below.
 
1.   Getty’s legal bond/proof of rights instruction with the image owner to recover any infringement charges.
 
This is clearly covered in the letters sent and is covered under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988.

Not the case if they did not supply you the terms of the agreement betwqeen the photog and getty.
 

2.   Image owner to provide exclusive copyright details of the image.
 
Our clients images are encoded with a marker which is identifiable with their software, When their images are located the details are cross referenced against their database of clients and if there is not a match a letter is sent to the websites owner. Hence we can prove the image you used belongs to Getty Images.

Highly doubtful that the image is encoded with "a marker", Getty owns picscout, which hits on similar images, they then cross refernce it
 
3.   Explanation and breakdown as to how the amount of £574.75 was calculated as a legal charge.
 
The charge made is for an infringement. There is no breakdown. You have used our clients image without obtaining the rights and therefore are being invoiced as they deem fit. You may wish to refer to a case earlier this year HOFFMAN v DRUG ABUSE RESISTANCE EDUCATION (UK) LTD for clarification of charges being made and awarded.

the above referenced case really does not apply to this..for several reasons. 1. The image in question in your clients claim, may or may not be properly reistered.
2. Getty may or may not have the exclusive license to this image.
3. The artist in question may not even be affiliated with Getty images any longer
4. this could be deemed an "innocent infringement" which would drastically reduce the amount getty could collect, if anything at all!

The above referenced case is being used as a scare tactic, and it shows the worst possible outcome, this is by design, to make your client more likely to pay.

here they are deeming you guilty, the image in question may very well be available elsewhere, this collection agency is not judge and jury..This "charge" is not a charge at all but a "claim" totally different beasts.
 
4.   If Getty Images are exclusive licensees for this image, then please provide license.
 
If you wish to use the image legally then you must first pay the settlement requested for using the image without authorisation. You can then be supplied with a figure for use of the image once details of the image use have been taken.

They completely avoided this question, because they know as well as getty knows, they may NOT have an exclusive license.
 
As we have fully responded to each point you have raised please confirm that payment of the £574.75 will be made immediately. If payment is not made we will have no option but to pursue the end user for the amount whereby court action will be taken if payment is not received.
----
You might want to look into the UK laws in regards to a collection agency, threatening a suit, I doubt they have the right to do this on Getty's behalf. I would also look into possibly reporting this agency for unfair / strong arm tactics...again you'll need to research this, before jumping the gun.

Question 4 is the question which i think they deliberately avoided answering. I am now going to wait and see how long it takes for them to send my client another letter. They have given deadlines firstly of 14days, then 5 days so will see what case they have and if they send any other threating letters.

Chances are good they have no "case"
Most questions have already been addressed in the forums, get yourself educated before making decisions.

Any advice is strictly that, and anything I may state is based on my opinions, and observations.
Robert Krausankas

I have a few friends around here..

Couch_Potato

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Re: Has anyone in the UK settled?
« Reply #6 on: July 26, 2012, 05:14:51 PM »
I'd write back and tell them that an infringement does not give anyone the right to charge what they like as their response claims and that I look forward to Getty explaining that to a judge.

I'd then report them for blatant lies in their letters to  consumer credit agency.

In answer to earlier point about statue of limitations I don't think one exists as it does in the US but is generally taken at 6 years. However Getty would have to explain to the judge why the lawsuit was so long in coming when there wasn't a complex mediation.

 

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