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Messages - goober

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1
What can be done if I want Iterasi to remove a page that they archived without my permission.

According to their copyright legal it states that they will remove if it is sent to their copyright agent.. which seems odd since they are the ones infringing to begin with.
See under copyright on page link below
http://www.iterasi.net/terms_of_service/

2
Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: damages
« on: August 07, 2009, 06:10:18 PM »
DMCA needs an overhaul....

3
Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: damages
« on: August 07, 2009, 06:43:06 AM »
Iterasi does save the actual webpages I think...they will not remove and I don't think they follow robots.txt at all.

4
Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: damages
« on: August 03, 2009, 08:08:16 AM »
I also requested by email that archive.org remove my website and they did so. I verified this by entering the url after they said all records had been removed and it was. I then placed a robots.txt file to block any further possible archiving by them as well as other similar sites. They do comply. Not all archive sites are doing this though, so your web history could be on other sites as well.

5
Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Windows Vista sample images
« on: July 10, 2009, 12:39:05 PM »
:S  I feel so confused!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! LOL!

6
Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Windows Vista sample images
« on: July 10, 2009, 06:08:59 AM »
Windows 7 RC1 also has sample images in the public documents folder although they all seem to be owned by Microsoft or Corbis. It is not clear at all to the average user that those images are in any way copyrighted unless you look at the properties for each image..and what average user does that?. There are no watermarks visible to the naked eye at all on the pictures. I would also assume as an end user of the operating system that if those images are provided by Microsoft in a public folder that I would have some rights to use the images.  

Don't understand why Getty images would be in the sample folder either since Corbis ( owed by Bill Gates) has plenty of images of their own that can be used as samples.  

If you are on XP it is very difficult to find the copyright information on sample images or the desktop wallpapers. On Vista and Windows 7 right click on the image and then properties on the context menu will give you the image copyright info you need. You still have to look for it though, it's not upfront and visible unless you are looking for it.

Here is another question. Suppose you created an avi file to help customers and in the background of the avi file is your desktop with an image ie, one of Microsoft's background images that they provide to you. The avi file is instructional to the end user and used for teaching purposes. Is that protected under the fair use policy?

7
You are correct Lettered, there probably is not one standard response to the Getty letter.
The fee that they requested was absurd and I was probably not at the top of their list for one image. I am not sure that using 20 images as opposed to one image makes much difference if the intent was the same. The end result would still be that $200 fee you would pay ( per image compilation being one image) if they found it was not willful infringement in court.

 Maybe the way these companies are using technology should be carefully reviewed. Personally I feel that using steganograpy and bots to find images on personal or business sites intrusive of my right to privacy. No one can enter your home and search it without a warrant, and they have to have a specific reason for that warrant. If they thought you stole a TV and the warrant was for a 52 inch tv, I don't think they can look in a small drawer for that tv.  

It's my personal server that the bot went on to find the image, irrelevant to it being on the internet. My server is my tangible property, it is not some ethereal space just out there floating around. If this searching by bots is allowed to go a step further, imagine your home PC now being searched for copyrighted images.....I do expect if things continue down the road this way, we might all have to worry.

8
Hi Lettered,
I wrote to archive dot org and specifically asked them to remove all archived information that they had. They did so. You are correct about Robots text file and the archive dot org. It appeared again when I removed the Disallow, which is why I emailed them to remove the entire history that was archived. I then tested it again with robots on and off and it was removed. But someone had to manually remove it, robots txt will not do that.  

Those are the nice guys ...many will not remove and about all you can hope for is the robots or htaccess to block their IP. Iterasi, domaintools and aboutus use robots.txt but of course you already know how that works.

9
I am sure someone will eventually file a lawsuit against Getty unless the state AG's take action first. Even though it's Masterfile, I believe this does set a general legal precedent if the plaintiff's win their cases.

10
Some things might be fair use, such as the composition of a picture but if Getty does not actually have a legal copyright to an image then isn't claiming a copyright when none exists constitute fraud? Sending a letter via the USPS demanding money for images that they might not legally own the copyrights too does seem a bit on the edge with what is legal and what is not legal. The letters they send assume you are guilty. They even state that it doesn't matter where you obtained the images from, YOU don't have a license even if the web designer did have one. It seems that they have made a legal determination of guilt without any due process. How do we know what the terms of use were back in 2006 for Getty or MF? Perhaps they have changed or were too vague to enforce as stated by Pixelmill. See paragraph and link below. Can they now retroactively change their terms of use and claim copyright infringement? Can I now use the statement by Pixelmill to show that iStock was retroactively vague and we do not owe them any money.

 Pixelmill had a problem with iStockPhoto regarding just this , and when they (Pixelmill) contacted iStock they ( iStock) agreed that their usage policy was a bit vague and they would not take action against those who have already used their images.Here is the link regarding this. http://www.pixelmill.com/support/kb101435.htm


PixelMill is a very popular site for web designers. Lots of templates with images.
I would personally not use any image that I did not create myself or a photo that I did not take myself at this point. Not with 2 lawsuits filed against Masterfile the latest being June 23-09 http://www.rfcexpress.com/lawsuit.asp?id=48167
This is not new though, this has been going on for years with these stock photo companies. But with new digital steganographic techniques it is making it much easier for these companies to find people and either sue them, or send settlement demands. They don't seem to be going after large companies though, just the smaller companies who are more likely to settle. I bet they didn't expect this ELI forum to blossom as it has. Kudos to you Matthew and Oscar!


Here is another problem though, Archive dot org is not the only site that archives your website.
Iterasi.net does as well as aboutus.org. Domaintools too. They unlike archive dot org refuse to remove old thumbnails no matter what. So I think these stock photo companies should hold these archives responsible for their images since they are the ones now hosting the images on their sites, even if you remove the images from your site. So how do we get them to remove the images? You do have some control over Aboutus but the others are looking for a letter from a lawyer to remove the images.  I think we need to mention these sites since it affects all of us who do not like our sites being archived without permission. It should be illegal to do that without permission from the site owner or at least they should be required to follow the robots.txt or a request to remove the images and or thumbnails. The stock photo companies should not be able to use those archived images to claim copyright infringement. How do you know those dates or images on the thumbnails are correct?  What if for one second you did a mock up using a Getty image and the archive site took a snapshot at just that moment in time. How long was that image up there for? 10 seconds, one hour or one year?  Not sure if I like corporations acting like big brother on the internet.

11
Another lawsuit seems to have been filed in June against Masterfile.
http://www.rfcexpress.com/lawsuit.asp?id=48167
Defendant is Masterfile , looks like a software company is the plaintiff.
Have no info on the details of this suit at all but I am quite sure this ELI forum is helping others.

12
What about iterasi.org...they index and won't remove at all...how do we get them to remove old thumbnails and what do we do with aboutus.org...they have a few sites that index.

13
I didn't see this on the forum, so again I have to apologize in advance if this information has been posted.
This concerns Masterfile not Getty.
http://www.courthousenews.com/2009/04/03/Double_Billing_Alleged_for_Internet_Images.htm
It appears that a lawfirm in Nevada has filed a lawsuit against Masterfile for one of their clients. Seems there are some civil conspiracy issue with Masterfile and a web design firm. Not sure of the veracity of this PDF file from the site link above but thought it was interesting.

Also, I did find my proof of purchase for the templates where Getty claimed I had infringed on their copyrighted image. I did my homework on the company that I purchased from and it seems they are spreading these images ie as templates everywhere in the world which probably are then being used by web designers for their customers. I cannot believe Getty has not gone after the company who is distributing them.

14
I don't know if this will help anyone, but there is an online tool you can use to search for images online. So if you are not sure that you really have the copyright for the image this tool scans the internet and finds the image, although if it's been extremely altered it might not find it at all. Read the TOS for the use of Tineye. I think they do keep the images you upload for 72 hours before deleting them.

Not bad to see if anyone else is using your images either. It's TinEye dot com. I didn't follow all the threads on this forum so if this information is a duplicate, I apologize.

15
Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Contacting the Photographer Directly?
« on: June 19, 2009, 03:27:32 PM »
It might help if the Photographer was contacted and asked if he sold or transferred his copyrights over to Getty and when. I couldn't find a copyright registration for the image that I was supposedly infringing on either, at least under the artists name.  There are lots of individual artists in other countries that might sell their "Copyrights" to various companies and copyright laws in other countries can be lax and rarely enforced.

So what happens if the photographer or artist sells their image to a few different companies, including Mambo? It would be interesting to see if the other big stock photo companies have identical images that they are claiming copyrights to. Maybe they should start going after each other.

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