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Messages - Greg Troy (KeepFighting)

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1051
Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: An Experiment Against Getty
« on: October 05, 2012, 12:30:16 PM »
Got the link, thanks!


Yes, please do. You can send it to me through the ELI message system or email me directly at [email protected]. Thanks!

If you want more information let me know and I'll message where you can get it.

It's not really a secret and as I said, this information is freely available but I'd rather Getty didn't know where I sourced it.

1052
Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: An Experiment Against Getty
« on: October 05, 2012, 06:48:51 AM »
Never! ......Teamwork!

I hang my head in shame...That is all...carry on.

1053
Here's a story from over at DieTrollDie about a local news I-Team report on IP/P2P Porn Trolls.

http://dietrolldie.com/2012/10/04/texas-news-sotry-on-copyright-trolls-scott-noll-khou-11-news/

1054
Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: An Experiment Against Getty
« on: October 04, 2012, 09:20:12 PM »
Thank you gtilflm and peeved, I appreciate the kind words.

Be sure to go back and look at my previous post as I have edited it in added court documents that I found pertaining to the lawsuits mentioned in that 2007 article.

1055
Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: An Experiment Against Getty
« on: October 04, 2012, 08:29:29 PM »
Stinger, you can rest assured that I am not going anywhere in that I plan to be here fighting and assisting others as long as ELI is needed. This is also the reason why I have been so open with my experiment so that others may join in the fight and can view and use my letters as a template for theirs.

Just because I have now placed the ball back in Getty's court does not mean I am here sitting on my hands. While I feel that my current packet is greatly improved over the information I had included with my previous complaint letters I am still continuously reading and researching through the net, court cases and rulings for items that are relevant and bolster ELI's side as well as things that will show a long history of questionable business practices by this company.

As a matter fact just last night I found a very interesting article from back in 2007 when Getty was a public company where to shareholders filed lawsuits against Jonathan Klein as well as other top Getty executives were accused of backdating stock options so that they could rake in huge personal profits. I would like to preface this by saying I have not had a chance as of yet to read the suits or find out what their outcomes were so I do not know as of yet but one of the stockholders bringing the suit says that 21 out of 25 of the discretionary grants just happened to coincide with his story close in the stock price making the redemption of the stock options extremely profitable for the executives. A link to the article may be found here:

http://seattletimes.com/html/businesstechnology/2003610937_getty10.html

So again rest assured that I am not going anywhere and I will be here and continue to help everyone I can.

<----Edit---->

I just got done going over the information in the article above and found that to stockholder lawsuits were result. I have uploaded the complaints from PACER to my Scribd account and will make them available here. From what I can see the parties agreed to settle in Getty paid the plaintiffs legal fees which in one case was $900,000 but it appears that the settlement was caused by the merger of Getty resulting in Getty no longer being a publicly held company. It looks as if at least in the Edwards case that he was trying to say that Getty was doing this to kill the cases. I have scanned the complaints and the order and found them very interesting and wanted to share them with the rest of you.

This is the kind of information whether it be recent or old I am looking for an if anyone has more information, articles, court cases or rulings about Getty or a relevant to the Getty/troll issues please share them.

Edmonds v Getty complaint:
http://www.scribd.com/doc/109044444/Edmonds-v-Getty-Shareholder-Complaint

Edmonds v Getty stipulation:
http://www.scribd.com/doc/109044445/Edmonds-v-Getty-Stipulation

Edmonds v Getty order:
http://www.scribd.com/doc/109044443/Edmonds-v-Getty-Order

Lopez v Getty lawsuit:
http://www.scribd.com/doc/109044451/Lopez-v-Getty-Stockholder-Lawsuit

Greg:  My fear is that all this work you have done to prepare for the "War to end all wars" with Getty will be for naught, because they probably don't have the stones to push you any further.

What I hope is, if they push hard on anyone here on this forum, that you might take what you have learned to guide that person in taking the fight to Getty.

This war isn't over when one of us win.  It is over when the trolls start trolling and get back to the business they are supposed to be in, rather than using the law as a business plan to go after the small fish.

1056
Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: An Experiment Against Getty
« on: October 04, 2012, 08:10:19 PM »
Yes, please do. You can send it to me through the ELI message system or email me directly at [email protected]. Thanks!

If you want more information let me know and I'll message where you can get it.

It's not really a secret and as I said, this information is freely available but I'd rather Getty didn't know where I sourced it.

1057
Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: An Experiment Against Getty
« on: October 04, 2012, 08:19:54 AM »
I appreciate the information couch patato, I breifly scanned it and it looks interesting.  I will read it in detail when I get home this evening.  Thanks again! :)

1058
Legal Controversies Forum / The Uneasy Case Against Copyright Trolls
« on: October 03, 2012, 10:58:30 PM »
This is an article over on DieTrollDie, while I have not read the entire article yet what I have read was very good and I thought I would share it.  The author of the article is Shyamkrishna Balganesh and the link provided to it is here:

http://dietrolldie.files.wordpress.com/2012/10/ssrn-id2150716.pdf

1059
Not so fun fact (at least for Lisa Wilmer) ;)

several of my initial Getty letters had been signed by my Getty penpal Douglas Bieker. Once I started my experiment against Getty and my complaint letters went out to all the different agencies naming not only Getty but Douglas Bieker amazingly the correspondence I received from Getty stop being signed by anyone and just said "The Compliance Team". Now that my experiment is over and I am ready for the fight I have a new and improved packet ready to go out should I receive any communication from Getty or anyone representing Getty such as Timmy. I liked the idea in my complaint letters of adding a face to the complaint besides the corporate entity that in my opinion is trying to extort money from me. So, should there be another communication from Getty itself that is unsigned the face that will be placed on my complaint will be senior director and corporate counsel Lisa Wilmer since she must be aware of and give the green light on any communication I receive regarding this matter. In addition to the new packet there would be complaints filed against her with the Bar Association. I did notice that when my complaint from the Washington state Better Business Bureau was forwarded to Getty it was sent directly to Lisa Wilmer for response.

I am also wondering if any of the more recent letter recipients can tell me if the compliance team specialists are still signing their names or have they started shying away from that send someone apparently is advocating naming them personally in your complaint letters ;).

1060
Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: An Experiment Against Getty
« on: October 03, 2012, 10:10:41 PM »
Thanks Jerry! It has been a very interesting experiment and I have learned quite a bit from it. This experiment was designed so that I could learn how the different agencies worked, what results I could expect to receive from my letters as well as trying to determine how far up the letters would seem to go. I still advocate for letter recipients to send out complaint letters as the more that are received the sooner we will hit the tipping point where action may be taken.

I now have a new enhanced packet which contains much more relevant information and packs a considerably bigger punch ready to go should Getty or any representative of Getty like Timmy be foolish enough to contact me again. Without revealing too much information or tipping my hand I will say one of the issues that I discovered during my experiment is that the complaint letters don't seem to get into the hands of the people who can actually do anything about it. I also question the filing system and organization of some of the agencies such as the Washington state Atty. Gen.'s office. When Robert sent his request for copies of all the complaints filed against Getty it took nearly 3 months for him to receive it, if all the information was together in one Getty complaint file it would not have taken that long. This begs the question how do they know how many complaints are on file if they have them scattered all over the place. One of the major differences with my new packet is I have correlated a lot of this information to show how many different complaints there are with the different agencies in addition to recent court rulings and cases lending credence to my contention that what Getty is doing is abusing the copyright law and practicing what I consider to be legalized extortion.

I also believe I now have a way of delivering these packets directly into the hands to the main people of several agencies and congressional committees bypassing the hordes of overworked and well-meaning underlings who are doing the very best job they can but keep this information from moving up the chain of command where it can make a difference.

So for me the experiment is over and I am ready to begin the real fight, I am just waiting for Getty to provoke the next round where much like Gen. Maximus I intend to unleash hell and will be much more than a bee in the Getty bonnet.

At my signal, unleash hell....




Greg, I didn't hold out much hope for contacting the state AG's. And I know some people on here were even more pessimistic, considering any interaction with government agencies a complete waste of time. But I must say this "Experiment" is proving to be quite effective in raising awareness. Of course it yields the added bonus of putting a bee in the Getty bonnet.

Good work!

1061
Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: An Experiment Against Getty
« on: October 02, 2012, 07:03:43 PM »
Thank you for the kind words Stinger.

As far as determining the revenue I think it would be rather hard since Getty is a private company and not required to release financials like a publicly traded company. I have searched quite extensively for their financial records and can only find them posted back before they went private after that there is nothing. The only hint I have as to the revenue that they make from their extortion demand letters is that 2009 Los Angeles times articles where Lisa Wilmer states that they catch approximately 42,000 cases of cha-ching infringement a year. If we take into consideration the range of what Getty's considers to quallify as their pound of flesh it seem to be on average between $850 and $1250, so let's average that to an even $1000, that leaves Getty with the potential earnings of $42 million. I would imagine with the use of Pic-Scout now they have even more.

I do not know if they send letters to the majority of the pictures they find as I'm sure some are licensed and I seriously doubt if they send their extortion demand letters to large companies with legal staff that can defend themselves or even sue Getty, these companies probably get a C&D letter if anything. I'll tell you a figure I would be interested in finding out is what is the actual percentage that knuckle under and pay Getty.


Great letter Greg.  You lay out your case quite clearly and provide lots of detail in the links.

It's interesting how with a little time and organization, the arguments of the people on the ELI forums get stronger, while Getty just appears to jabber around the same old BS.

OK, maybe they do read this forum and have cleaned up a couple of things, but really, if they wanted to stop unauthorized use of their images, they would be much farther down that road today than they are.  They are just in it for the Trolling money.  I wonder if there is a way to discern how much revenue they raise in trolling versus legitimate licensing?

1062
Legal Controversies Forum / Is it Time to Repair the DMCA?
« on: October 01, 2012, 10:42:26 PM »
Here is a good article about the DMCA and the issues the Internet is facing with the flood of DMCA takedown requests. The article is found over at plagiarism today's website and the article can be read here

http://www.plagiarismtoday.com/2012/09/27/should-repair-dmca/

also if you read all the way down to the bottom there are links to other articles about DMCA issues if you are interested.

1064
Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: An Experiment Against Getty
« on: October 01, 2012, 10:28:43 PM »
Today I received a letter from the Ohio State Atty. Gen.’s office in response to my complaint against Getty images. One thing I found interesting in reading over Getty’s response which shows to me that they actually do read our forums as well as my posts. I have been blasting them for sending out there form letter time after time in getting the name of my company wrong as well as the amount they are claiming against me as well as other errors in their letter. This new letter while based on the framework of their standard form letter response has been modified and corrected. Besides getting my company name right and the amounts they are claiming one of the issues I was nailing them on was they continually stated that I had found the image in question through a Google in Internet search. While this paragraph was left intact they did stick an additional sentence on the front of it correctly stating that I found it on a website where was offered for free but the rest of the paragraph is exactly the same as it was before.

They are still claiming that they cannot provide me with proof due to confidentiality agreements between themselves and their artists yet they still forget to mention the fact that I had offered to sign a confidentiality agreement binding me not to discuss or disclose any of the information except for the purposes of trying to settle in their response to this was that it would take too much time and cost too much money to provide me with the proof.

A copy of the Atty. Gen.’s letter and Getty’s response may be found here:

http://www.scribd.com/doc/108649883/4-4-Getty-Response-to-Ohio-Atty-Gen-Complaint

And my reply countering their arguments and requesting to be added to the file may be found here:

http://www.scribd.com/doc/108652664/4-5-Reponse-to-Gettys-Reply-to-Ohio-AG-Complaint-Redacted

I sincerely hope that other extortion letter recipients will use the examples I have provided and join in the fight sending out as many complaint letters as possible because together we can make a difference and I truly believe in the long run between recent court decisions, rulings and other agencies starting to take notice change will come. Stay strong and keep fighting!

1065
I wouldn't be surprised if I saw uncle Glenn pull an Alaska stock and try to declare bankruptcy ;)

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