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Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: An Experiment Against Getty
« on: September 11, 2012, 09:31:40 AM »
Perfect, I will get a letter together and my info this weekend and send it out on Monday. Thanks!
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1112
Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Got 3rd Getty Letter Now I'm Not Sure
« on: September 10, 2012, 08:52:45 PM »
Generally when I was corresponding with Getty there was about a 2 to 3 week turnaround time between letters so you should be due for something very shortly. Definitely keep us posted as to what is going on.
1113
Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: An Experiment Against Getty
« on: September 10, 2012, 08:50:05 PM »
@Stinger,
That is great news! Would you be willing to share the contact information and address of who you corresponded with at the Library of Congress as I did not send the letter to them with my original series of complaint letters. If I can get that information I would be happy to send a letter to them as well so that we can work on getting the number up to a point where they will take action.
Again great work and keep fighting!
That is great news! Would you be willing to share the contact information and address of who you corresponded with at the Library of Congress as I did not send the letter to them with my original series of complaint letters. If I can get that information I would be happy to send a letter to them as well so that we can work on getting the number up to a point where they will take action.
Again great work and keep fighting!
1114
Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: ELI Factor - Oscar, Robert & Matthew Threesome!
« on: September 09, 2012, 11:39:15 PM »
1115
Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Copyright Attorney Leslie Burns shows her ignorance
« on: September 08, 2012, 02:50:24 PM »
LOL! That is great SG! Thanks!
1116
Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Watch out for that Bus!!
« on: September 08, 2012, 02:13:03 PM »
I agree with you Matthew, what Matthew Inman did is a perfect example of how to use the media and the Internet to fight for your rights. I also remember even the EFF joined the fight on his side, and like you said it ended up being a win win win for him. Troll Carreon went away with his tail tucked between his legs, well over $200,000 was raised for the Cancer Society and the Wildlife Fund, he did not need to hire lawyers to fight his battles and the end piece of perfectly and politically got to thank everyone who supported him and rub Carreon's nose in it with the following post.
http://theoatmeal.com/blog/charity_money
http://theoatmeal.com/blog/charity_money
1117
Legal Controversies Forum / Re: A few bytes of something sweet
« on: September 08, 2012, 09:04:33 AM »
I saw this article on another site and didn't get a chance to post it yet, I think the CNN article is better than the one I found anyway. Humorous story and thanks for posting it!
Boston Cream Thing anyone??
http://www.cnn.com/video/?hpt=hp_c3#/video/us/2012/09/07/ben-and-jerry-sue-porn-company.wcax
1118
P2P/BitTorrent Lawsuits Forum / Copyright Trolls' Bogus "Negligence" Theory Thrown Out Of Court Again
« on: September 07, 2012, 03:38:01 PM »
Here's an interesting article I found over on the EFF website. Apparently judges on both coasts have now ruled that the P2P trolls can no longer use their favorite tactic for suing which is the assume negligence of the defendant for not monitoring their Internet connection.
I consider this another victory for the anti-troll side and it seems of late we seem to be on a roll. Between favorable court decisions, rulings and legislative bodies starting to take an interest in trolling activities I feel like I am starting to see the light at the end of the tunnel. I think the only way that the trolls can possibly avert this is if they change their business model to asking for damages which are in the de minimis infringement range of about $150-$300. But as long as the trolls are asking for exorbitant sums and filing frivolous lawsuits they will continue to garner the attention of the courts, legislative bodies and anti-troll activists.
https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2012/09/copyright-trolls-bogus-negligence-theory-fails-court-again
Quote
The "negligence" strategy had three fatal flaws, according to the court. First, an Internet subscriber like Mr. Hatfield has no legal duty to police his Internet connection to protect copyright owners like AF Holdings. Second, even if AF had a valid "negligence" claim against Mr. Hatfield under state personal injury law, federal copyright law would override it. This is called preemption. And finally, even if copyright law didn't trump a negligence claim, Section 230 of the federal Communications Decency Act probably would.
I consider this another victory for the anti-troll side and it seems of late we seem to be on a roll. Between favorable court decisions, rulings and legislative bodies starting to take an interest in trolling activities I feel like I am starting to see the light at the end of the tunnel. I think the only way that the trolls can possibly avert this is if they change their business model to asking for damages which are in the de minimis infringement range of about $150-$300. But as long as the trolls are asking for exorbitant sums and filing frivolous lawsuits they will continue to garner the attention of the courts, legislative bodies and anti-troll activists.
https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2012/09/copyright-trolls-bogus-negligence-theory-fails-court-again
1119
Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Got a letter, now what???
« on: September 07, 2012, 08:33:59 AM »
Depending on how you approach this there are two reasons, the first approach was I was answering the question in this thread of do you ignore Getty's letter or do you send one letter, so my response was based on the premise that you're going to send one letter and be done so you must cover all of your steps in one letter.
I myself did not send my offer with my first letter as my approach is more of I am going to make this a serious time suck as well as being a thorn in Getty side approach. However, at some point I did make what I considered to be a reasonable offer contingent on proof of claim. The reason for the contingency is that Getty is still sending me an invoice but has not yet proved that I owe the money.
As to what a judge would do or not do you can never tell but I believe it shows good faith on the part of the letter recipient when you can say that (in my case):
1) I dispute this claim and any infringement however, if there was infringement it was innocent and nonwillful and I have proof in the means of screen captures of where the image was obtained showing the image belonging to someone else and being offered up for free. Also Getty is currently being sued by Rock Photo for infringement in Getty's defense is that the infringement if at all was innocent and therefore they should not have to pay.
2) I have requested that Getty provide me proof of their claim of exclusive rights to the image in question as well as the signed contract giving them rights to pursue and collect damages.
3) I have let Getty images know I am willing to continue to discuss and negotiate this claim.
4) in the response letters to complaints filed with various agencies Getty always claims they cannot provide proof because of confidentiality agreement signed with the artists. I have offered to sign a similar agreement binding me not to discuss, disclose or reveal anything in the proof I have requested except for the purpose of settling this claim to which Getty has replied they still will not provide proof as it just takes too much time and expense.
5) I made Getty images what I considered to be a reasonable offer contingent on proof.
Items three through five are all contingent upon proof being provided. Since you never know how a judge will react or respond I think it is best to cover all of your bases as thoroughly as you can to show you have negotiated in good faith and were willing to try to settle this claim yet Getty has refused provide any information. And since Getty is making the claim and sending the invoice the burden of proof rests on their shoulders not mine.
I myself did not send my offer with my first letter as my approach is more of I am going to make this a serious time suck as well as being a thorn in Getty side approach. However, at some point I did make what I considered to be a reasonable offer contingent on proof of claim. The reason for the contingency is that Getty is still sending me an invoice but has not yet proved that I owe the money.
As to what a judge would do or not do you can never tell but I believe it shows good faith on the part of the letter recipient when you can say that (in my case):
1) I dispute this claim and any infringement however, if there was infringement it was innocent and nonwillful and I have proof in the means of screen captures of where the image was obtained showing the image belonging to someone else and being offered up for free. Also Getty is currently being sued by Rock Photo for infringement in Getty's defense is that the infringement if at all was innocent and therefore they should not have to pay.
2) I have requested that Getty provide me proof of their claim of exclusive rights to the image in question as well as the signed contract giving them rights to pursue and collect damages.
3) I have let Getty images know I am willing to continue to discuss and negotiate this claim.
4) in the response letters to complaints filed with various agencies Getty always claims they cannot provide proof because of confidentiality agreement signed with the artists. I have offered to sign a similar agreement binding me not to discuss, disclose or reveal anything in the proof I have requested except for the purpose of settling this claim to which Getty has replied they still will not provide proof as it just takes too much time and expense.
5) I made Getty images what I considered to be a reasonable offer contingent on proof.
Items three through five are all contingent upon proof being provided. Since you never know how a judge will react or respond I think it is best to cover all of your bases as thoroughly as you can to show you have negotiated in good faith and were willing to try to settle this claim yet Getty has refused provide any information. And since Getty is making the claim and sending the invoice the burden of proof rests on their shoulders not mine.
I don't understand the logic of making an offer subject to proof of claim.
The logical order of things to me would be:
1) Receive a claim from Getty.
2) Ask Getty to prove their claim.
3) If proof is received then assess what you feel is reasonable and make an offer based on the specific factors of the claim.
Would a judge penalise somebody who had taken the time to deal with the issue just because they hadn't written down arbitrary figure in a reply to a claim that had no proof?
1120
Legal Controversies Forum / Re: Is Congress Getting Ready to Take on Patent Trolls?
« on: September 06, 2012, 02:42:37 PM »
I agree with you and am currently working on this problem as well. We also do not want to forget all the other pressure that can be brought to bear on Getty through other agencies and the complaint letter writing campaign. We need to continue to advocate to people who feel as we do that would Getty is doing is wrong to send out complaint letters and inform them of the process and what the expected results can be. I greatly appreciate letters you have sent out in your support of the campaign as well.
Greg, nice find! I hope that you are correct that Congress's recognition of the patent troll problem will lead to their recognition of the copyright troll problem.
Unfortunately, I believe that we cannot take that for granted. We should work hard to help Congress realize that there is also a large copyright troll issue, and that the laws need to be addressed to correct this.
It really doesn't take long to write those letters. And it is good for the soul.
1121
Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Got a letter, now what???
« on: September 06, 2012, 02:34:08 PM »
While you are correct that contacting the Washington State Atty. Gen.'s office will not do you any good as an individual it doesn't add your complaint to the many others filed there and the more complaints that are filed the sooner the tipping point will be reached where they feel the company needs to be investigated. I know that there are over 60 complaints currently on file against Getty images for their extortion settlement demand letter practices.
Also I think you'll find more letters like this you file and the more of a nuisance you become the less interested Getty may become with you. When there are so many out there that pay out of fear or without doing research why would Getty want to waste time and money on someone that is going to fight back and fight back hard. It also bolsters your case if you can show that not only did Getty not provide you with the proof that you filed complaints against them for their practices.
Also I think you'll find more letters like this you file and the more of a nuisance you become the less interested Getty may become with you. When there are so many out there that pay out of fear or without doing research why would Getty want to waste time and money on someone that is going to fight back and fight back hard. It also bolsters your case if you can show that not only did Getty not provide you with the proof that you filed complaints against them for their practices.
Hi Greg - that makes a lot of sense. I'll continue with my letter.
I also did e-mail Mr. Fewer and here is his reply (helpful for any Canadians that visit the site dealing with GettyImages):QuoteWriting Canadian officials will not be of any use except in cases in which
Getty has made a misrepresentation (ie, they don't own title, etc.).
Unfortunately, this is a legal matter. If you do not feel comfortable
dealing with Getty on your own and you don't want to pay them to go away,
you will have to hire a lawyer.
As the FAQ we sent you should have indicated, ignoring Getty is a strategy
that has worked in the past, although there is no guarantee that Getty
will continue with its policy of not suing in Canada. This strategy will
result in 2 years of continuing harassment. There is a 3 year statute of
limitations on copyright infringement - after that, you are safe.
I cannot advise you what to do - it is a matter of your personal capacity
for risk and tolerance for harassment. It should also be clear, I hope,
that you are not obliged to pay what Getty demands, even if you are in
fact liable. You are only obliged to pay damages. Getty's demands
generally are in excess of those damages.
Bolded & italicized text is my edit to the message - while my tolerance for risk and harassment is low; I'll have to "suck it up" for the next few years and pray they never decide to make an example out of me. But from what I've read they won't be able to get much anyways...
Also would appear that contacting the US OAG would not be helpful - at most it may alert them to their tactics of harrasment of individuals/companies accross the border but they may not be able to do much to assist.
1122
Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Got 3rd Getty Letter Now I'm Not Sure
« on: September 06, 2012, 02:27:13 PM »
And I agree with Matthew you should make at least one offer that is "reasonable"and I don't consider half reasonable. Look and see what you can find similar images for which are generally anywhere from $2 up to $40 and make them an offer based on that. On Getty's own site I found images similar to the one they claim I had infringed ranging between $10 and $25 so I made them an offer for $75 but also made that contingent upon Getty providing proof they had rights to the image and the money was owed. Since Getty does not provide proof of claims the matter has pretty much stalemated there, yet should Getty ever be so foolish as to try to take me to court I can show I have made good faith efforts to try to resolve the matter with them. Please keep us posted as to how your case goes.
@ Greg....
LOL!!!! I didn't look at it from that perspective of course. All I could think about was what Matthew said about having made at least an offer - to show that I was working with them in the unlikely event it did go to court; as it would make them look a bit worse in refusing to work along with me.
LOL! When I read your comment it actually made me choke on my coffee ... I definitely see your point so I've taken it out of the letter and have sent it off.
But like I say we all know they wouldn't accept the offer anyways - and it was indeed in the letter that I wouldn't pay anything until proof was given first ... of which we also know they won't ever provide either. That's why I mentioned if it were me on the receiving end of that letter I would have considered it a bit of a stalemate and just close the "case." But that's too sane and rational for them ...
Will definitely let you know what comes next - although I think we already pretty much know how it will go.
1123
Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Got a letter, now what???
« on: September 06, 2012, 02:16:57 PM »
I believe the issue with ignoring the letters can be if Getty should ever decide to take you to court and then they can get up and say we sent him X amount of letters and he never responded which makes you look bad. I think you'll find that most on the form advocate sending one letter, admitting nothing and informing them the image(s) have been taken down and at the same time requesting proof of claim from them. You may also wish to make a "reasonable"settlement offer which I did in my case but also made the offer contingent upon Getty providing proof of claim. Inform Getty that if they do not provide proof of claim that you consider the matter closed and will enter into no further correspondence or negotiations until they provide you the proof.
The reason that you will find we advocate sending at least one letter is so that you are covered should Getty ever decide to take you to court. This way you can get up and say I made a reasonable offer of settlement and offered to continue negotiations and the only thing I requested was just proof of Getty's claim to the image. Now the ball has gone back to Getty's court where you have made an offer, offered to continue to discuss the matter in all she wanted was proof, yet Getty now has refused to provide that.
Also if Getty's claim is just for one image you can feel a little easier as Getty to date has never taken anyone to court for one image. The fact that you are in Canada increases the difficulty in Getty's tactical most likely be just a harass you with letters.
I have made my correspondence with Getty available as well as complaint letters that I have filed with various agencies against Getty and if you are interested in seeing any of the information it can be found in the thread linked below.
http://www.extortionletterinfo.com/forum/getty-images-letter-forum/an-experiment-against-getty/
I hope this helps and please keep us informed as to your situation.
The reason that you will find we advocate sending at least one letter is so that you are covered should Getty ever decide to take you to court. This way you can get up and say I made a reasonable offer of settlement and offered to continue negotiations and the only thing I requested was just proof of Getty's claim to the image. Now the ball has gone back to Getty's court where you have made an offer, offered to continue to discuss the matter in all she wanted was proof, yet Getty now has refused to provide that.
Also if Getty's claim is just for one image you can feel a little easier as Getty to date has never taken anyone to court for one image. The fact that you are in Canada increases the difficulty in Getty's tactical most likely be just a harass you with letters.
I have made my correspondence with Getty available as well as complaint letters that I have filed with various agencies against Getty and if you are interested in seeing any of the information it can be found in the thread linked below.
http://www.extortionletterinfo.com/forum/getty-images-letter-forum/an-experiment-against-getty/
I hope this helps and please keep us informed as to your situation.
So I'm finally getting around to writing my letter - I procrastinate too much, part of which is because everytime I come to this site or any of the others out there that are fighting GettyImages my stomach turn and I can feel more hair dropping off my already balding head. Not the sites but the "fear" and anxiety that these letters seem to trigger...
Anyway it'll be a long while before I'll get over it.
I've read several posts from Canadians on other sites that say "ignore, ignore, ignore" however most here say don't ignore. I'm confused.
Why would I want to ignore them? Why should I not ignore them?
I appreciate all the feedback rec'd from everyone! This is a great site with a lot of superb information.
1124
Legal Controversies Forum / Is Congress Getting Ready to Take on Patent Trolls?
« on: September 04, 2012, 10:15:48 PM »
I found this article over on EFF and thought it was extremely interesting. Apparently the Congressional Research Service which is the investigative arm of Congress has been looking into the patent troll problem and appears about ready to act on it. This is why I have started my letter writing campaign and am trying to get others to join in as the more letters we can get out and get into the right hands the more things like this will happen.
Hopefully it would not be too far of a stretch for them to move from patent trolls to copyright trolls. Here is the link to the article and I think you will find it extremely interesting.
https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2012/08/congress-seeks-research-patent-trolls
Hopefully it would not be too far of a stretch for them to move from patent trolls to copyright trolls. Here is the link to the article and I think you will find it extremely interesting.
https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2012/08/congress-seeks-research-patent-trolls
1125
P2P/BitTorrent Lawsuits Forum / Re: Pirate Bay founder arrested in Cambodia upon visit of Obama ambassador...
« on: September 04, 2012, 08:06:09 PM »
Great articles and a great find SG. Thanks!
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