Messages

376

Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Sanders Law is now Representing RM Media Ltd. (UK Photographer Nick Youngson)

« on: May 23, 2017, 09:52:20 PM »

It's too much to repeat here.  But there was a whole bunch of things I noticed after this discussion thread broke out:

http://www.extortionletterinfo.com/forum/getty-images-letter-forum/nicholas-youngson-photographer-(rep-by-higbee-associates)-copyright-abuse/

The guy initiated the thread and did a lot of research which led me to look Nick's honeypot websites more closely. I initially thought his websites were owned by 3rd-parties but then learned they were likely owned and operated by Nick himself with almost no disclosures or identifying information.

Many of our readers are very observant and online detectives themselves. I have been impressed by how sharp and sharp-eyed some of our readers are.  They come in cold but then get themselves up to speed and starting picking up or reporting details that I miss. 

I give a tremendous amount of credit to ELI team of supporters and readers to the nuggets they uncover and share over the years.

People know that I am a clearinghouse of information.  When I get good information, I pass it along to the ELI team and pass it forward to the readership. I encourage a "pass it along" and "pass it forward" mindset around here.

As you can see, there is a mish-mash of discussions that come out. And people randomly jump in and out of discussions also. As such, unexpected ideas and information comes out.

Even I was schnookered in missing certain details of what Nick's websites were all about because I wasn't paying close enough attention. A reader who was doing his own investigation brought certain details to light that I did not catch previously...

Just out of curiosity, what details?

377

Getty Images Letter Forum / Sanders Law is now Representing RM Media Ltd. (UK Photographer Nick Youngson)

« on: May 23, 2017, 09:16:59 PM »

I received a submission today from a reader who thought I might be interested to know that he received an extortion letter from Sanders Law representing RM Media Ltd.  And that reader was right on the money. I am interested in receiving in information of shifts and changes in the industry.

For clarification, Sanders Law is best known around here for their legal representation of BWP Media (who deals with celebrity photos). For clarification, RM Media Ltd. is the corporate entity formed by UK photographer Nick Youngson.

Previously, Nick Youngson through Mathew Higbee & Associates gained some notoriety by lambasting numerous people with $5,000 extortion letters for Nick's $10 or "free creative commons" images (free with fine-print attribution). I railed on the fact that his websites looked like honeypots and snagged his careless victims with  "free creative commons" images.  Those website seemed misleading and gave little indication it was Nick's website.  I was really shocked at the number of people last year who came out of the woodwork in such a short period of time over the Nick Youngson images. Even I was schnookered in missing certain details of what Nick's websites were all about because I wasn't paying close enough attention. A reader who was doing his own investigation brought certain details to light that I did not catch previously.

For a while there, there was a huge run on the team of Higbee & Associates/Nick Youngson complaints but then it got all quiet.  Well, based on early appearances, it would seem Sanders Law is Nick's new legal partner in crime.  Whether Nick is actually using two different lawyers/law firm simultaneously remains to be seen.

My feeling is that Nick moved his business to Sanders Law. This time around, coming out the gates, the email letter I have clearly states RM Media Ltd as the photographer/copyright owner. No trace of Nick's name on the letter itself.

But my information is incomplete. I was not able to see the online account (looks disabled now) which shows the actual amount they are asking for. I was told that Sanders Law on behalf of RM Media was asking $1,800, not the $5K bullshit we saw before.  Sanders' $1,800 is much lower than Higbee's $5K demands but still obnoxiously high when we are talking about Nick's self-priced $10 images / free with attribution images.

Because of the incomplete information I have, I still welcome additional information regarding this new working relationship between Sanders Law and RM Media Ltd. I really want to see some of the support attachments (settlement agreement, representation agreement, something with a dollar amount, etc.) if someone is willing to email them to me.

IN the meantime, I will continue to keep my ears to the ground. I still maintain my general opinion that copyright owners in the UK will be challenged to file any lawsuit in the US. It is tough and expensive enough for any U.S. copyright holder to file suit. My guess it is a bit tougher for people outside the U.S. to do so. I am not a lawyer but it strikes to me that the copyright owner would need to fly to the US to testify in any lawsuit situation. So victims should take that into consideration in how they approach the settlement matter.

378

Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: RM Getty Images in wordpress theme I bought. Help!

« on: May 23, 2017, 04:37:19 PM »

I agree with clist here. The developer needs to be notified of this situation and they need to look into it so they can provide you an explanation.

As Robert pointed out, don't get the true developer confused with the reseller of the theme. Two different parties. Having said that, if there is something bad going on with the developer, you should get your money back from the reseller.

If I were in your shoes I would contact the developer of the theme (and possibly themeforest) first to get to the bottom of this.

I think when most people purchase a WP theme from themeforest they expect that the included images are ok to use and if they are not then the theme developer will most likely include generic placeholder images in place of those images in the download. --> I've purchased several themes from them and I have found this to be a common practice.

It sounds to me like the developer messed up - I'd start there.

Good luck.

379

Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: I am confused- respond or not

« on: May 19, 2017, 05:51:39 AM »

Not a full substitute for reading but my ELI Support Calls are quick, direct, and gets to the heart of the issues and I separate fact from fiction. A lot gets covered in 30-minutes of discussions.

After an ELI Support Call, my clients get a huge jump start on the matter and some back end support after the call.

First of all, so you know, it's Matthew Chan.

Second, I took the subtext of your post to say, "Look, I'm to busy for this sh#t, just tell me what's going to fix it." Sorry, but it's not that easy. There are many paths you can take when dealing with this. One is to simply pay the man. Sorry if that seems brusque.

I post on here because I feel the "business model" of Getty Images is dishonest and I'd like to help see their con stopped. But when someone seems to be too busy to read the posts and get up to speed on the nature of the scam, I guess I get short.

I would HIGHLY suggest you set up a phone call with Matthew. He'll figure out the details of your case, talk you down from making a rash decision, and probably save you hundreds of dollars.

Good Luck!

380

Higbee Associates Letter & Lawsuits Forum / Re: How can I verify a copyright Certificate of Registration number online?

« on: May 17, 2017, 07:53:12 PM »

Thank you, Stinger, for saying that and "getting" me. And most importantly, thank you for being part of the ELI community.

And yes, many copyright extortion lawyers hate ELI and the information and ideas we share. They wish ELI would go away. They wish Oscar would stop being involved here. They hate the unity and community culture we espouse.  Oscar has the freedom to do whatever he wants but he seems to want to stick with ELI even after nearly 9 years.

Lawyers work in the court system and use that system to mitigate disputes.  That is not the only way to come out ahead here.  Matt has a reputation on this web site for thinking outside the box and working outside the court system.  He finds ways to discourage trolls from coming after him.  Some of Matt's methods might make lawyers cringe, but they work and are often more cost effective than going to a lawyer.

381

Higbee Associates Letter & Lawsuits Forum / Re: How can I verify a copyright Certificate of Registration number online?

« on: May 17, 2017, 07:48:30 PM »

You imply that your claim is much more than the $2,500 deductible.  Did you even try to negotiate it down?  People who turn to their insurance policies over most of these claims strikes me as a bad idea. It is a guarantee for a premium hike.

And only the uninformed every believe the printed settlement amounts is what it takes to get rid of it.  It is not uncommon to see 50% discounts or more for multi-thousand dollar claims but it requires fighting for it. It isn't handed on a silver platter.

Did you not consider getting on the Defense Letter Program for $250?

I think you may want to reconsider the claim until you get better informed.

Something feels very wrong about what little you shared. I think you need to do more reading.

I will quickly say that I ignored them and then got sued (I am not saying if it was Higbee & Associates or not - I do not want revealing details about my case posted online). I am a small operation with little income and less assets.   Thankfully, I have insurance and the insurance company looks like they are going to get involved.   A claims representative contacted me and said that most likely an attorney will contact me today or tomorrow.  My deductible is $2,500 - ouch because that is more than they originally asked for. 

I am thinking that I probably would have been better off calling them to explain my situaton and offer them something less.  I hear that the prices they are asking are negotiable.

I am in the process of applying for a loan and I had to disclose this law suit.  I have no idea what that is going to do to my loan.

I will post more later if I can.

382

Higbee Associates Letter & Lawsuits Forum / Re: How can I verify a copyright Certificate of Registration number online?

« on: May 17, 2017, 07:37:40 PM »

I would like to add to what Robert said, there is middle ground also.  You can lightly engage to feel out if they are willing to be reasonable. If they refuse to be reasonable, then go dark.   You can play ping-pong with them to gauge things out.  Or simply hire Oscar. Or simply go dark for awhile, THEN hire Oscar.

You see how that works? There are many permutations but people new to ELI are linear or black/white thinkers.  We are not afraid to get into the grey but people have to be receptive to talking in the grey areas.

There are actually many ways to play it but it does require someone to be open-minded, flexible, and adaptable.

Here's the thing, some people suggest I just ignore them.  Do you seriously think they're going to ignore me for ignoring them?  Today I went to two attorney websites that specialize in the same stuff you do.  Both of them give some basic do's and don'ts (on their websites) on how to handle situations like this.  They both say...do not ignore a letter from an attorney for copyright infringement.  Naturally, they both suggest getting a lawyer to represent them. to decide how to deal with this.  I read through the letter again and they give 30 days to respond.  I have plenty of time to figure this out and hopefully I make the right decision.

NO ONE ever said if you ignore they will ignore you, not sure where you got that.. By ignoring we mean, remove the image and question and get on with life, don't respond, don't email.. You pretty stated you have no funds to pay this..even more reason ( if it were me to ignore it)..let them sue you, you have no assets, even if they win, they lose, as they can't collect, and you get to publicly shames them for suiing a non-profit small minisrty that tries to do good..you have to deal with this on YOUR terms, not theirs, sometimes that requires hinking outside the box.

383

Higbee Associates Letter & Lawsuits Forum / Re: How can I verify a copyright Certificate of Registration number online?

« on: May 17, 2017, 07:32:29 PM »

I don't have a vested interest one way or another what people do.  What I do care about is telling the truth and dispelling so-called common knowledge. You make broad statements that is untrue in our corner of the world.

People always say "get a lawyer" and listen to them UNLESS someone listens to or hires Oscar Michelen. He isn't here on the ELI Forums very much anymore but I am still in regular contact with him over different matters. We have a few disagreements on smaller points but I don't think I am out of line when I say he agrees with some of the "street" knowledge/tactics ELI shares and discusses here. It may be edgy but not criminal or illegal. Oscar doesn't try to reel everyone into hire him. He actually dissuades some people because he knows the scam well and thinks of the victims instead of his wallet.

Some lawyers hate some of the ideas and knowledge we share because it makes their job much harder and it plays outside the system.  Lawyers prefer people pay and use the system.  The system has its place. It has its good points and bad points.

I have lawyer friends and associates. I respect them highly but I have been in business and lived "on the streets" long enough to see the pros and cons, strengths and weaknesses of lawyers. I have also seen enough to know that many problems get resolved not by trying to "outlawyering" your opponent.

Sometimes it is "out-spining" them (as in "get a spine").  Lawyers work for clients. Clients don't work for lawyers. People forget that.

This is the deal, hiring a lawyer is a luxury. It requires money. It also sometimes requires you to subvert your independence and options. Small-timers who can't afford lawyers have to pursue non-lawyer options and we openly discuss them here on ELI.

You keep saying you have little money but apparently that must not be true because you seem so eager to pay into a system in which many have not had to.  If the stress and fear is too much to bear, I understand. Do what you need to do. But that is YOUR issue and choice.  But for others, standing your ground and not getting rolled over and falling into extortionate demands is their choice.  And yes, they do bear the small risk for standing their ground.

I am not telling you to not settle or not engage. I am not telling you to ignore either.  I am also not telling you to not hire a lawyer. After all, we have Oscar Michelen and his defense letter program.

What I object to are your sweeping statements and assumptions which are greatly flawed. I don't mean to sound harsh but I feel strongly in my position.

As Stinger has said, I don't follow conventional wisdom. I do try to think creatively and unorthodox ways. We even talk about edgy ideas but I keep it in the "legal" column as in NOT CRIMINAL ACTIONS.

Ignoring a demand or ignoring a lawsuit would make most lawyers scream and run for the hills BUT IT AIN'T CRIMINAL.  And sometimes, it actually works and solves the problem much more quickly and efficiently than any lawyer could make it!

Just like NOT paying a debt. In the U.S., there are no debtor prisons or half the the U.S. population and all college graduates would be in jail. It doesn't mean I endorse not paying debts either. 

All I am saying is that the ELI Forums is a place for finer discussions and thinking when it comes to legalistic issues as copyright infringement enforcement issues.

I encourage people to think "rebelliously" and with a protest mindset. And for me personally and many people, it works quite well.

And stop blindly believing everything an extortion letter says.  Just because it says 30-days, does not make it true.  You have fallen into the trap. You seem to believe everything the letter says.

Here's the thing, some people suggest I just ignore them.  Do you seriously think they're going to ignore me for ignoring them?  Today I went to two attorney websites that specialize in the same stuff you do.  Both of them give some basic do's and don'ts (on their websites) on how to handle situations like this.  They both say...do not ignore a letter from an attorney for copyright infringement.  Naturally, they both suggest getting a lawyer to represent them. They both agree that if you do it on your own then let the attorney know the picture has been removed from the website and offer to pay whatever the going rate is for using the photo.  They warn not to give anymore information than that.  I think that's wise advice and I'm not sure why some people think ignoring this is a good option to take. 

Regardless, I think I need to step back now and process all this information I have and take a couple of days to decide how to deal with this.  I read through the letter again and they give 30 days to respond.  I have plenty of time to figure this out and hopefully I make the right decision.

384

Higbee Associates Letter & Lawsuits Forum / Re: How can I verify a copyright Certificate of Registration number online?

« on: May 16, 2017, 04:59:24 PM »

Higbee doesn't decide if a case goes to court.  The client does.  And generally speaking, they have to be willing to commit the upfront monies to file suit because most lawyers are not going to subsidize the fees unless they have a "sure thing" or a "big fish".

Your own false assumptions is going to your detriment and cost you. If you want to negotiate a settlement, fine.  But you are setting yourself up to pay more than necessary.

People think that being the "broke little guy" is a bad thing. In these types of cases, it is actually BETTER to be a "broke little guy". It is a deterrent to paying filing fees to try to sue and collect money from someone unable to pay.

It also drives down the settlement amounts, not increase them.

If Higbee wants to go to court he's going to spend a lot of money to find out that there's no blood to squeeze out of this turnip.

385

Higbee Associates Letter & Lawsuits Forum / Re: How can I verify a copyright Certificate of Registration number online?

« on: May 16, 2017, 04:53:28 PM »

Where is this "everywhere" you are reading? And who is writing this "information" you are getting?

I would submit to you that what you think you see is not representative of what is true. I think I have a much better view of the situation because I have spoken with/consulted with many Higbee victims. Not one of them has written back to me they got a lawsuit yet.

And I don't get the feeling all the people I've talked to coughed up the money to settle either. The fact I have not heard from them doesn't mean they haven't settled. But it doesn't mean they have also.

You have flawed conclusions. Do what you want and what you think is best for yourself but you making these broad statements about the Higbee situation is misleading and inaccurate as far as I am concerned.

Most of us who have been around know the psych games these people play and the lies they tell. We also know that that vast majority of cases don't face lawsuits. I monitor the lawsuit situation and it is still a relatively rare occurrence compared to the thousands of letters being issued every year by the copyright extortion industry.

Everyone always has a choice. YOU may feel you don't have a choice but that is factually untrue.

kingkendall, the thing is, everywhere I've read about people who have ignored Higbee they eventually heard back from him and he withdrew his previous offer and demanded more than he originally asked for.  I have not seen one case that was dropped or ignored by this outfit from people who ignored him.  Everything I've read shows that he will not let go until he gets money or takes them to court. 

If I ignore him and end up in court I might end up spending more money by hiring an attorney to settle this.  I can't afford it.  I understand either way is risky but since I haven't seen anyone post having success by ignoring this guy I feel I don't have any choice in the matter except to deal with him. 

386

Higbee Associates Letter & Lawsuits Forum / Re: How can I verify a copyright Certificate of Registration number online?

« on: May 16, 2017, 04:44:31 PM »

You are way too trusting and believing of the lawsuit threat. What you are stating is factually untrue in many cases.

People who are under the 3-year statute of limitations are not going to speak out.  And those that do make it to the 3-year mark will generally just go on with their lives. Some do report back.

And regarding Higbee & Associates, they only came on the ELI scene around two years ago.  Hence, nearly everyone who has gotten a Higbee letter and participates on ELI will not be reporting on anything until probably 2018 at earliest.

You are speculating a lot and making false assumptions.

You go do what you feel you need to do but I can tell you the compliant, obedient types are generally the big losers.

As other experienced people can tell you, there are no guarantees. If you are looking for one, then you cough up the money.

In my view, you are a candidate for Oscar Michelen's Defense Letter Program:
http://www.extortionletterinfo.com/2012-update-expansion-of-attorney-oscar-michelens-defense-letter-program/

If I don't respond in a few days this attorney plans to file suit and then it will end up in court.  I've been obsessed with this and have done countless hours of research.  It's clear that this outfit is known for not letting things go.  You either negotiate with them or go to court.  If there's been anyone who has had success in not paying some kind of a settlement with them, I have not found them here on this forum or anywhere else for that matter.

387

Higbee Associates Letter & Lawsuits Forum / Re: How can I verify a copyright Certificate of Registration number online?

« on: May 16, 2017, 04:34:26 PM »

Jerry,

I don't recommend getting in the dirt all the time. It depends.

For some people, just plain ignoring and avoidance is the better course of action.

Some people's dispositions and mindset are just not well-equipped to engage. As you know, there is no one answer fits all.

Matt often talks about being willing to get your hands dirty when dealing with these... uhhh individuals. I think this would be a perfect situation to do it.

388

Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Getty Demand Letter - Waited it out

« on: May 12, 2017, 12:47:32 AM »

You are welcome! Congratulations on getting past the 3-year statute of limitations. Glad to be of service and it is nice of you to offer your unsolicited testimonial. You didn't have to but you took the time to do so. Much appreciated!

Thanks ELI! I hope the best for anyone else in this situation!

389

Getty Images Letter Forum / "Private" emails/letters written by Masterfile collections lawyer, Leslie Burns

« on: May 09, 2017, 08:32:11 PM »

I am not sure what the deal is but Masterfile collections lawyer, Leslie Burns' name has come up a few times recently and I am seeing more of what she writes to Masterfile letter victims. She is going down the Timmy McCormack road and writing things to her targets that she probably don't want others to see. And she is going out to the edge in some cases.

I think the copyright collection business must be wearing her down because she gets snippy in her tone.  I also think she occasionally makes misleading statements in her attempts to intimidate and extract payment from unwilling, uncooperative, and disagreeable victims.

First off, she has this email footer which is contradictory and fully attempts to take advantage of a recipient's legal ignorance.

Nothing in this email is or should be taken as legal advice. Nada.
Unless you and I have a signed agreement, I am not your lawyer and this email is not covered by attorney-client confidentiality or privilege. Also, this email does not establish a lawyer-client relationship between us.

However, this email is confidential and may be proprietary or privileged. If you are not the intended recipient of this email, it was an accidental disclosure of its contents. Please reply to this email to let me know of the error, then delete the email.

1.  She claims she is NOT giving legal advice but she is spewing out a LOT of arguments and legal cases to compel someone to pay her money.

2.  She claims she is not bound by confidentiality or privilege. That means she can squeal on you and share any emails you write to her or anything you tell her. (I actually am okay with this.)

3.  However, Leslie claims the email is "confidential" and may be proprietary or privileged. So, she is trying to compel someone to NOT share her emails.  I say she is a hypocrite. People can legally share any emails they received whether it was intended for them or not as long as it was not obtained through illegal means (such as hacking).

Her entire email footer is entirely premised upon taking advantage of someone's legal ignorance. And guess what, I was not the intended recipient but it is legal for me to share the information because it was legally obtained by the recipient who then forwarded it to me.

In a copy of a recent letter, Leslie writes:

Nonetheless, before advising my client to file suit, I am making this resource-wasting effort to send a print copy of the original letter I emailed (attached). This effort is being made to confirm that you have been notified of the claim against you.

I am absolutely sure Masterfile wants all their lawyers to write in such a fashion. I am so sure that is appropriate lawyer conduct.  Leslie might be a newbie lawyer with very little litigation experience but I am pretty sure what she wrote crosses some line somewhere.

Let's get to the heart of the matter.  Prior to becoming a lawyer, Leslie Burns "clerked" for Carolyn Wright of Photo Attorney for many years in "copyright collections". Then when Leslie became a lawyer, she was a copyright collections lawyer for Photo Attorney.  Then Carolyn Wright supposedly retired and Leslie took over the role as Masterfile collections lawyer.

Generally, copyright collections lawyers work for a commission. I estimate it is a 30%-35% cut.  So when someone agrees to any settlement Leslie negotiates, people can estimate how much she is collecting.  Someone settles on a Masterfile claim for $2,000 that Leslie works, I estimate she gets at least $600.  Not bad for writing, sending, cutting, and pasting a bunch of threatening emails.

But she complains about sending someone a 50-cent snail-mail "resource-wasting effort" of notification letter.

Compared to our own Oscar Michelen, Leslie is an amateur. And even compared to her old mentor, Carolyn Wright. Carolyn is a lot smarter and experienced.

And if Masterfile has to file a lawsuit against anyone, I suspect they will get a real litigation lawyer, not Leslie. Nothing we have found indicates that Leslie has much litigation experience.

I wonder what other "unusual" letters and emails written by Leslie will turn up in my email inbox.

390

Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Getty Images (Cabinet Bouchara Avocats) Attempts to Intimidate ELI to Kill Links

« on: May 09, 2017, 10:38:47 AM »

Whether or not, this was an intentional act by Getty Images, most of us will never know.  But most of us are not buying the "mistake".  In either case, Vanessa Bouchara was the one who took the fall for it. And she was the one who issued email apologies to all U.S. letter recipients. But that probably would not have happened had I not contacted Eugene Volokh of Washington Post's Volokh Conspiracy who covered the story.  Eugene gets the credit for the Getty and Bouchara apology.

I have no false illusions that it was me or any of the other recipients that motivated that. But getting written about in the Washington Post was not something Getty Images liked very much. Hence, the public statements.

My speculation/opinion:

Sounds like an example of where US lawyers didn't want to touch this one. Instead of giving up, the parent company went overseas to find someone willing to take on the case. There must have been some internal drama on this one.

Your response probably validated their US lawyers' concerns about the approach...