Famous letter in.... the Netherlands!

[Nelis Infra]

Hello all,

There it is, a $12.250 letter from Getty. This case concerns 11 images. Since there hasn't been a lawsuit yet (because a lawsuit over 3 or 4 images would be to little, according to Oscar), my question is if 11 images would be enough for Getty Images to sue. My letter is from Getty Images London, while I am in the Netherlands. Is there anybody else who got the letter and lives/works in the Netherlands? And if so: did you pay, or did you sue?

Besides, has there been any lawsuit yet against Getty Images? Please inform.

With best regards.

[SPAgetty]

Hello Nelis,

We also received a 3.600 euro Getty letter today. I coulnd find any other dutch cases so far.
The advise im reading everywhere is to remove the pictures and ignore the letters.



With best regards

[Oscar Michelen]

So far Getty has filed a few lawsuits here in the States for sites that had over 20 images. It looks like the defendants did not contest them and settled right away. So we don't know if any of the issues we raise here were raised in court there, not likely.  Copyright is granted automatically in countries such as the Netherlands that have signed the Berne Convention, meaning as soon as a person creates a work, it is covered by copyright. This means that technically it is not necessary to include copyright indicators such as "copyright © 2006."You need to look up Dutch law to see if it follows the UK law (no damages at all for innocent infringement) or if it follows US law (allowing damages even for innocent infringement)

[Nelis Infra]

Thanks Oscar for you quick reply. At what point can you speak of 'innocent infrignement' in the States? What I'm saying is: in fact you are never really innocent on the Internet, are you? What is innocence? If you capture a picture from Google Images / Altavista Images? If a third party gave you the pictures / implented the pictures for you? How is innocence defined in U.S. / U.K. case law? Difficult question I suppose...

Second: do you think 11 so called Getty images is a lot? Certainly 12.250,00 EUR is... What I mean; how weak is your position compared to someone with 1 image?

Third: how big is the chance that Getty will sue overseas?

Forth: do you represent Dutch cases as well, Oscar?

Fifth: I've listened to your phonecall with Matthew (on the frontpage) and you said that it is a matter of time before Getty will sue. But if I understand you correctly, there's only been settlements. So no lawsuit yet? And how about the people who have received the Getty letter back in 2005/2006? Shouldn't they've been sued by now?

I'll be glad hearing from you Oscar!

Thank you very much in advantage!

With best regards.

[Oscar Michelen]

I answered most of these questions on your other post Nelis.  I cannot handle a Dutch case unfortunately, but you are in a stronger position than in the US. Innocent infringement is a case by case issue, Why should someone not believe their web developer when they prepare their site for them? If you downloaded it from some site that claimed they were free and public, then you are innocent as well.

[saweb]

We have received the infamous Getty letter today for 1 image and are supposedly now expected to pay €1000.

We are taking measure to remove the "offending" image as I type.

Do you think it's advisable to contact Getty in relation to this matter or simply remove and ignore?

Were a Dutch company as well so interested to hear what other Dutch companies have done in relation to this matter?

thanks
John

[Oscar Michelen]

As a lawyer I cannot counsel you to "ignore it." Getty has not sued ever over just one image and they are not likely to start doing so now. We have been contacted by numerous Dutch companies and like US companies, their approaches vary based on how much grief and risk they can take. I welcome any other Dutch company that is involved in this matter that follows this forum to post thier experiences.  As to your particular situation, alot will depend on how long the image was up and from where the image was acquired. I would remove the image and make them a settlement offer in the range of what you would have paid for the length and manner of use. Good Luck and keep us posted

[rikwa]

Thanks for your comments Oscar, I just send you a mail before gettting to the forum, now I have some answers allready.

We have also received the 1000 euro letter for 1 image, which was allready deleted from the site 2 months before receiving the claim.

Being in the intellectual property business myself I do acknowledge the right to defend copyrights But I do believe it is the law ( or at least common practice) to first send a infringement warning, allowing you to delete the images or stop any other form of infringement. Starting with a claim is a form of extortion indeed.!

I tried calling Getty but the are allways in answering machine mode.

Is there a Dutch lawyer who has a similaer approach and letter as Oscar? Please reply.
Also /: does any of the former posts lead to a more positve settlement?

thnx for your info

RIk Wagter

[Oscar Michelen]

It is common practice to send a cease and desist letter first but it is not the law (in the US anyway) unless the infringement is covered under the new DMCA where internet service providers are entitled to a letter before litigation. Haven't come across a Dutch attorney willing to pick up my model yet

[dutchnaomi]

Hi everybody,

Not my best day today....also got a letter from Getty with an amount of € 6.500,- excl. VAT for the use of 6 pictures. I have a company in the Netherlands and my letter also came from Getty Images UK.

First of all, I'm very glad that I have founded this website, this morning I was really stressed out but now I'm a bit more relaxed knowing I'm not the only one in this case and there are people working on it :-).

Nelis; since you got your letter in february, how is the situation today? Did you get a lawyer or didn't respond at all? As you may understand I'm very curious about your case.

Hopefully we can keep in touch and more Dutch cases will attend this forum!

Kind regards Naomi

[Oscar Michelen]

Dear Naomi:

While we wait for Nelis to respond, I can say that I have not heard of a lawsuit actually having been filed in the Netherlands.  Hopefully Nelis can give us an update and tell us the statuts of his case at this time.

[johnboy12]

I can give somewhat of an update. We received the letter about 4 months ago for one image and simply chose to remove the image and ignore the letter. We received an additional letter some months later but nothing since and I will of course keep this site updated with progress as and when things happen.

[Oscar Michelen]

Thanks for the update and yes, please keep us posted !

[dutchnaomi]

Hi everybody,

UPDATE : Just received another letter from Getty Images... The first letter came about 2 months ago. I already removed the pictures but I didn't pay. I'm not quite sure they checked my website again but they noticed they haven't received any payment... ;-)

If I'll get new information I'll keep you guys posted! If anyone has some other news please let me know!

Kind regards,

Naomi

[Oscar Michelen]

thanks for the post