Messages

211

Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Masterfile Letter

« on: June 28, 2012, 09:14:17 AM »

I would guess that when the forum started, Getty Images may have been the most egregious offenders among the trolls and that inspired Matthew to name it the "Getty Images Forum".

Since then, so many wannabe trolls have jumped into the fray that it now seems like a misnomer. Maybe just "Images Extortion Letter Forum" would be more accurate now since it includes so many different entities participating in trolling activities.

If you had a specific forum for each of the image companies, the information would be fragmented and it would defeat the purpose of creating strength by the union of the victims who have suffered or are suffering from pretty much the same abusive practices. Having them in one place gives us the opportunity to compare their different approaches and devise solutions for each approach.

Each individual case is different and the nuances are important. Little by little we're taking apart their model and finding the weaknesses that help us fight back.

I guess Getty gets the "honor" of having the forum after them for being a pioneer in the trolling business, and for providing us with the clown prince of copyright trolls, who doesn't even need to be mentioned by name here.

212

Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: FunnyJunk Attorney Charles Carreon's Wife, Tara Carreon Shows Her Stuff

« on: June 28, 2012, 09:02:37 AM »

Surely she has licensed all of the copyrighted footage shown behind her on the screen. Is that not an excerpt from The Matrix? I think I've seen that scene before.

Good find, lucia!

213

Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Getty & Collection Agencies

« on: June 28, 2012, 08:49:44 AM »

Anakin, very glad to hear you're not going to roll over and pay them. The less the trolls are fed, the weaker they get.

I'm not as experienced as the other members but from what I've read, they've tried that trick for some time. It's the weakest attempt at extortion because a collection agency can not continue to harass you. Tell them you owe Getty nothing and to please stop calling. Record the name of the person if it was a telephone call and keep any records. If they call you can again, you can file a complaint against them at your local consumer protection agencies. They're not supposed to keep calling.

Getty may decide to continue to scare you by having attorneys contact you with half-baked claims which are usually very poorly documented. Don't buy it, the attorney only has two choices: make noises for 3 years until the statute of limitations runs out, or actually take you to court. Generally they won't bother with the latter unless the amount they're claiming is worth their while.

If you get a call from McCormack or his office or anyone else about this matter, don't talk to them except to say they must contact you in writing. It's not a good idea to try to field a call on any legal issue. They're prepared to attack and you're not prepared to respond. You don't have to talk to them and don't forget that anything you say can and will be used against you.

Maybe you could share more details about your particular case, including any communications they've sent you. Everything you share will be of great help to this group and to future participants who find themselves in a similar situation. This group has been reverse engineering their sleazy methods and it empowers everybody to know what to expect from the trolls.

You are making the right choice by fighting back and you will prevail.

P.S. After writing this I realized you had already posted your letter. The group has responded with some very solid advice. Way to go, everybody!

214

Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: ELI Video Updates Ends. The ELI Factor will launch soon.

« on: June 27, 2012, 06:43:07 PM »

WOW! This is ready to be syndicated! Can't wait for the show!

215

Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Masterfile Letter

« on: June 27, 2012, 06:33:36 PM »

goodnesssake, Buddhapi's suggestion has many advantages. The decision about bulk registrations is still on appeal and it may take some time before a decision is made.

Once they receive a letter from Oscar Michelen or any intellectual property attorney representing you, they have to stop harassing you directly. Oscar Michelen's letter program will buy you time while that decision is made and get the Masterfile trolls off your friend's back, so he can concentrate on getting well. The last thing a person needs when they're ill is the stress that comes from dealing with these legal henchmen.

Additionally, Oscar Michelen is very keen on that particular aspect of copyright law. I think he would be the best choice for that reason alone. The price is incredibly low for the service you will get and for the expertise that backs up the service.

Check out this page for more information:

http://www.extortionletterinfo.com/oscar-michelens-getty-images-defense-letter-program/

216

Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Hello and I just got a letter from Getty

« on: June 27, 2012, 10:44:54 AM »

Forgot to mention, I like Buddhapi's suggestion to give THEM a deadline to respond to you, about as long as the one they're giving you. That will reinforce the notion that you're not afraid of their nonsense and that you're calling them on their bluff.

217

Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Hello and I just got a letter from Getty

« on: June 27, 2012, 09:59:16 AM »

While I agree with Buddhapi and S.G. that your case should be considered "fair use", I bet I can tell you what Getty is going to be responding with: The terms of use were violated.

Out of curiosity, I decided to search for the Windows 7 End User License Agreement on the web, where it was readily available at:

http://tinyurl.com/75woesg

As Buddhapi mentioned, this is section 3, item (c):

c. Icons, images and sounds. While the software is running, you may use but not share its icons, images, sounds, and media. The sample images, sounds and media provided with the software are for your non-commercial use only.

However, they would be totally wrong. Your particular use was not commercial. Under the fair use guidelines provided by the U.S. Copyright office, your use has been defined as allowable by precedents set in case law:

The 1961 Report of the Register of Copyrights on the General Revision of the U.S. Copyright Law cites examples of activities that courts have regarded as fair use: “quotation of excerpts in a review or criticism for purposes of illustration or comment; quotation of short passages in a scholarly or technical work, for illustration or clarification of the author’s observations; use in a parody of some of the content of the work parodied; summary of an address or article, with brief quotations, in a news report; reproduction by a library of a portion of a work to replace part of a damaged copy; reproduction by a teacher or student of a small part of a work to illustrate a lesson; reproduction of a work in legislative or judicial proceedings or reports; incidental and fortuitous reproduction, in a newsreel or broadcast, of a work located in the scene of an event being reported.”

Source: http://www.copyright.gov/fls/fl102.html

Their legal department should be aware of this, but you're probably getting letters from clerks at this point. From what you wrote, it sounds like they're not even being very specific about what has been infringed, when it was infringed, or how.

S.G. is right, their deadlines are moot. They're just trying to scare you into paying them some money they are not due because they assume you're ignorant about the law and will pay out of fear. Once they realize you're not going to roll over for their fatuous claims, they'll probably squirm away. They don't have a track record of taking people to court for such a small amount of money, so the odds are very much in your favor.

S.G.'s suggestion is good because it lets them know you're not ignorant nor afraid of their posturing. The more you read about it, the more you will feel that your position is indeed much stronger than theirs.

218

Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Hello and I just got a letter from Getty

« on: June 27, 2012, 08:58:15 AM »

Welcome, alanspicer. There is some good information on the forum from about 3 years ago. There were similar problems with the wallpaper that came with Vista and it was discussed in the forum at that time:

http://www.extortionletterinfo.com/forum/getty-images-letter-forum/windows-vista-sample-images/

If you use the search bar at the top of these pages to search for "windows wallpaper" you may find other information of interest regarding "baitpaper" websites.

This also speaks to the issue of End User License Agreements (EULAs), which most of us click through without really reading their contents. Many of them are incredibly long and cryptic. If you look through the Windows EULA document that comes with the OS disc or the computer, it probably has some mention about those images buried deep in the legalese.

Do any of you have the EULA for Windows 7? It would be interesting to take a peek to see if there's any mention of the included "sample images". I think a case could be made that Microsoft is not showing good faith by essentially including "baitpaper" in their software on behalf of Getty or anyone else.

Also worthy of consideration: Bill Gates apparently owns Corbis. Ahem.

http://chzmemebase.files.wordpress.com/2011/01/memes-make-billions-keep-hair-cut.jpg

219

Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: FunnyJunk Attorney Charles Carreon is a Tool & Dumb Extortion Lawyer

« on: June 27, 2012, 12:12:19 AM »

It's quite obvious what the "dividing line" is: Inman is funny, the Carreons are boorish, mean-spirited douchebags.

It looks like they're bent on proving that there IS such a thing as bad publicity. The Streisand-On-Steroids Effect!

220

Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Recieved a demand letter today.. What do you think of my response?

« on: June 26, 2012, 03:14:16 PM »

Nice, Lucia! Very specific.

221

Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Lessons and closing thoughts from a letter recipeint

« on: June 26, 2012, 01:19:17 PM »

Lessons for copyright owners and their attorneys

• The court system is designed for people who can't settle their differences in any other way. It should not be used as a threat upon first contact.
• If you think someone took your photo, contact them, inform them you own the copyright, and ask them to take it down. Most likely they don't realize they are infringing.
• If that doesn't work, you can file a DMCA takedown notice.
• If that doesn't work, try a Cease and Decist
• If the infringer refuses to cooperate, only then should legal action be mentioned.

Over the years, I've seen dozens of my own images used on other people's sites. I've even had my entire website cloned, twice! I have always found that a simple email resolves the situation.  The fact that these threat letters immediately ask for extreme amounts and threaten legal action shows that they're all about money, and not about protecting copyrights at all.

It appears the trolls are perfectly aware that they could do these things first, but refuse to learn even after they get whacked. Why? For the same reason criminals keep committing crimes — they're addicted to their "success" and the thrill of "getting away with it."

Just read the amazingly revealing statements Glen Carner made during his brief appearance as a contributor to this forum. The man seems to think his "business model" is perfectly righteous.

We wish they would learn, but I wouldn't count on it. Great post, though. I couldn't agree more with your points.

222

Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Getty's 3rd Letter and My Site Doesn't Exist Anymore!

« on: June 26, 2012, 12:27:43 AM »

Buddhapi and luis1984, it's a pleasure to be of help. This forum did for me what I hope it does for others — it empowered me to take the reins in the situation and make level-headed decisions instead of rushing into committing unforced errors.

I will always be grateful to Matthew Chan for this forum. Let's not forget he didn't have an ELI to turn to, so he had to deal with his trolls solo, like some kind of Chuck Norris plotline. Not only did he succeed, he created ELI for the rest of us.

I guess this is my way of showing my appreciation. Right on, Matthew, thanks again for launching this great resource.

223

Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Getty's 3rd Letter and My Site Doesn't Exist Anymore!

« on: June 25, 2012, 07:36:08 PM »

Luis1984, welcome to the ELI forum. It's understandable that this situation is stressful to you, especially during a time when you're feeling vulnerable because you're starting your new career. It sounds like you made an honest mistake, but this kind of stuff is happening to people with plenty of experience too. There are many circumstances under which people are getting these letters.

The first thing you need to do is conquer your fear. A lot of us have felt the stress of having to deal with people bullying you for money and threatening to escalate to ridiculous lengths to collect on an infringement issue. The "worst case scenario" sounds terrible, but there are some facts you could consider that would help you understand the situation. Knowledge will help you conquer that sick feeling.

First, you have to consider your realistic options:

1) You can pay them and make it go away if you don't want to deal with them. You mentioned you did not want to do this.

2) You can get some very sound advice from Matthew Chan for a very reasonable fee (a contribution to ELI for $50 or more) if you need to "quickstart" your knowledge curve with a coaching session by phone. Here's a link with more information:

http://www.extortionletterinfo.com/eli-phone-support-call-with-matthew-chan/

3) You can hire Oscar Michelen, a very experienced intellectual property attorney, to take over as your representative by writing them a letter and fielding their communications on your behalf. This effectively means you won't have to deal with them directly so you can focus on getting back to work. Amazingly, Oscar Michelen only charges $195 for what should cost many times that much, especially from an attorney of his caliber. Here's a link with more information:

http://www.extortionletterinfo.com/eli-phone-support-call-with-matthew-chan/

4) This option does not cost anything except your own time and effort: Read this forum carefully and learn as much as you can retain. It's a lot of stuff, but at least skim through the titles of the topics and check out the threads regarding Getty Images cases. The more you learn and understand about what these people are doing, the more you will feel that you don't have to pay them. The more you read, if you're anything like myself and other members of this community, the more you will WANT to learn. This option will be of invaluable help to you whether you take any of the other three options as you enter a career in which you will have to deal with this sooner or later. It should be required reading for the communications industry and every profession related to it.

Those letters are intended to sound scary. They want you to roll over and pay them to make them go away. The reality of it is that your case is really not that important to them. $844 is a relatively small amount of money and if they've already written you 3 letters, they're probably getting the feeling that they're wasting their time already. It does them no good to put an expensive attorney on your case to collect an amount that's insignificant to them and that you can't pay anyway.

I don't think anyone's ever been taken to court for an amount that small. They very rarely go to court at all, and when they do they're going for thousands of dollars and/or multiple infringements.

Good luck with your case and do keep us posted on your situation. We're keeping track of what these copyright trolls are up to. In union there is strength and in knowledge there is power.

224

Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: Ongoing List of Copyright Trolling Firms and those associated with them

« on: June 25, 2012, 01:24:28 PM »

HAR!

Brilliant.

Soylent Green is people, my friend! Real funny people at that! 

225

Getty Images Letter Forum / Re: My Response Letter to NCS

« on: June 25, 2012, 12:45:35 PM »

You already have my lawyer listed.  Let's see, I:

• skipped Getty
• skipped the collection agency
• skipped the paralegals, and
• went straight to an attorney.

I must have been very, very BAD!

That's pretty funny. I wouldn't take it personally. These trolls just see us as a checkbook with a phone number and/or mailing address. They just try different things and maybe keep track of the mess they're making to see what works best for the least effort and expense.